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July 4, 2012 by dignity
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Darrell & Justin discuss the new system of challenging independent characters in the new 40K 6th edition… but who will be the new kings of close combat?
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To bad Arjac has to challenge himself to death
what about logan grimnar….shame darrell missed him… he has a +2up/+4up armor/ward save and with his axe you are getting off 5 power fist attacks 6 on the charge. and only one less wound than calgar
Squad leaders are characters too. The example on page 63 gives a SM vet sarge as an example.
Is Bjorn a character? I think Dreadknights can challenge as well. Would something like that be effective against Abbadon?
what about orikan powered up with 2 chronometrons attached,plus a Dlord for P enemy. no armor saves, rerolls to hit,s,t7 A4 not bad, 2 rerolls, but thats situational since he might not be powered up. obyron does have the 2+ so he doesnt care about ap3 pweapons… or the Dlord T6 no ID, with PE, not bad ap1. whats abaddons invuln?
As well as unit leaders! (I know it is said before) Haven´t you noticed that?
The avatar could go close! And karandras I 7 A 7 on the charge don’t dismiss the spandex and the hive tyrant with lash wip would destroy him . Swarm lord ?
From the 6th ed rule book, page 64 bottom paragrath of “Fighting a challenge” :
“For the duration of the challenge, these two models are considered to be in base contact only with each other.”
Mindshackle Scarabs + Warscythe = Stop hitting yourself Abbadon + Splat
Hallucogenic grenades might be of use too!
Daemon weapons are power weapons, Drach’nyen strikes at S8 AP3 and re-rolls failed to wound rolls, so abaddon bounces his hits off terminator armour, so who beats abaddon? Calgar, will do it. Who’ll beat Calgar?
Lysander? He has 1 less attack but a better invul. IIRC Logan used to be able to beat Calgar, although with his axe being gimped and the changes to preferred enemy that might not be the case anymore.
On the video I don’t see my GK techmarines hating this. Give them the warding stave and they can tie up the opposing sarge while keeping his squad buffed with the grenades. Now extra cool, especially if you pay for brain mines as well(which I do anyway) Also having looked at the CSM FAQ, they got kinda screwed. Abaddon is hitting with Ap3, and poor old Kharn is now hitting at I1 thanks to his axe, which means he stands a good chance of getting killed first by a power/force weapon.
I bet the new codex will overrule that lol
He will always be awesome
I’m what now?
I’m not 100% sure on this one so forgive me if I’m obviously wrong but I don’t think that Mephiston or the Sanguinor or Death Company Tycho can challenge anyone as they are all one man units and don’t have the independent character special rule.
You don’t have to be an Independent Character to fight in challenges, just a character which is a new unit type and includes named special characters. mephiston is mentioned by name on the characters page.
Thanks for clarifying.
As it stands challenges will not be an issue for my Eldar HQ as I generally take a Farseer and an Avatar. The Farseer is mounted in a Falcon and never intentionally gets out anyway let alone into combat and the Avatar isn’t part of a unit either so it will make no difference as far as he is concerned. The Exarchs would struggle but I can’t see my opponents big CC hero wasting a round of combat just to take out the Exarch not when he could decimate the unit instead. I think the losers will be the big named characters as you say.
I’m not sure how useful your Farseer will be to you stuck in a Falcon any more fella… Don’t you need line of site to use Psychic abilities in 6th ed..?
I’m sure for Eldar Psychic powers, Doom, Fortune and Guide no you don’t. I only need los for the shooty powers of which he takes only one for a rainy day. His sole job is to enhance my armies abilities, not get himself into trouble
they faq’d psychic powers. guys in transports can only affect themselves, the unit in the transport, or the transport itself.
p67 BRB under dclare a target, it says: “Unless otherwise stated, the Psyker must have line of sight to his target. This means that a Psyker embarked on a Transport can only target himself, his vehicle or another unit embarked on the same vehicle as the Psyker”
the eldar power don’t say anything about not needing LoS, so… they do now.
Since no Ork in the whole Codex has eternal warrior, I’ll have to get an Ork Warboss on a Warbike… I think that’s the toughest i’ll ever get.
Doesn’t Ghazghkull get it from one of his pieces of wargear?
You’re right… Forgot about the adamantium skull thing. In fact, it says: immune to instant death… Maybe that’s why I first missed it as I was looking for the Eternal Warrior special rule.
Swarmlord would be pretty nasty, or a Bloodthirster.
the broodlord 83 points: ws7 bs 0 s 6 t 5 w 3 i 7 a 4 ld 10 sv 4+ rerolls 1s to hit, rerolls to wounds if strengh is equal or greater than ememys toughness, rending, implant attack (to wound roll of 6 causes instant death),and the icing on the cake, hypnotic gaze (both players roll a d 6 and add their leadership if the broodlord rolls equal or higher than the targets score, that model may not attack in the ensuing combat)
Ok.. a Destroyed lord with two cryptec with crono’s.
hey guys love what your doing haven’t read the new rule book yet but wondering does this make those strong characters your talking about less effective in combat now. I play grey knights and i love my draigo wing army and now with the new rules i think im going to take a fortress of redemtion as my long range shotting and sit a troop choice of 1 paladin inside. but back to the point now instead of having abadon or arjak having to do their attacks across the group i can now just take all their attacks on the one paladin so i may definitly lose that one charecter but if i get to go at initiative 6 i may have a chance of putting a couple of wounds on him before i die. also with that space wolf squad could i do multiple challenges for each charectrer you and i have. I imagine my apothecary wont last long any more but i might just keep rejecting the challenges with him.
I would go with a wolf lord on a thunder mount, thunder hammer, wolf tooth, runic armor, storm shield, saga of the bear to take on abandon.
Palains will be better because they all benefit from the character rules as they are characters in the reference at the back of the book.
The ultimate bodyguards with the draigo still be able to take 90% of the hits with 2+ look out sir
I would say that Typhus is quite good when compared to Abaddon. FAQ makes Manreaper both a Daemon weapon and a Force Axe. It also counts as a poison weapon. Destroyer Hive causes enemy units to not gain their bonus Attacks for charging Typhus or unit he has joined. He is pretty survivable for not having a invul save.
The Good Manreaper: Force Axe, Daemon, Poison Mark of Nurgle + Termi armour + Feel no Pain Destroyer Hive
The Bad: Strikes at the same time as Power Fists No Invul No Eternal warrior
5+ invul but better than nothing
To know who a character is check the back of the book for the reference of everything, this is where the reference for hull points
In that reference it will say who is classed as a character if your unsure
It’s interesting that one of the coolest combat characters is a member of the Imperial Guard!
Colonel “Ironhand” Straken has WS5, S:6 (S:7 on a charge), hits at I:3 (I:4 on a charge), with 3 attacks (5 on a charge) that ignore armour saves (or use 2D6 to penetrate vehicles).
I’ve checked the FAQ and he hasn’t been changed from the Codex (other than to clear up some text), so he doesn’t have a power weapon, he’s just rock!
He also has Counter Attack and Furious Charge (which he also gives to his puny guard mates)… all round he’s an auto-include in my new Veteran Guard Army… sorry Orks, you’re going on hold for a while.
Iron hand actually effectively has 4 attacks, since he has a CCW and pistol, but, he’s a bit of a glass cannon with only a 3+/5++ save, and importantly, no eternal warrior, so unless abaddon rolls a 1 and Drach’nyen hits him(funny thing, now daemon weapons are more effective against their owners since the rebellion attack ignores armour save…) any one of abaddon’s 6-10 S8 attacks-that go first- gets an unsaved wound and Iron hand becomes “thin greasy paste Straken”..
Hmm I do have the old model convert as part of my armageddon ork hunter kill team, and that may become my new ‘counts as’ col for my new gaurd I have had on the shelf a mixed regiment of survivors from armageddon.
unless i’m mistaken, he’s I3 on the charge, as furious charge no longer gives +1I. and even though he has 3 attacks in his profile, he always gets 4 for having 2 CCWs.
and, good find .
Never mind Straken- one of the best assets the Guard have from a challenging point of view is your no-frills squad Sergeant. Sure, he’ll die, but in doing so, he’ll be holding up whatever ridiculous HQ choice your opponent is fielding for a full round of combat, giving you a better chance of winning the combat overall.
A nemesis dreadknight with a greatsword will take abaddon now (until the new book of course) lol
But people have the forgotten the big bad swarmlord and making his opponent re-roll failed saves ouch!
Woah guys what about Lysander? Lysander is the man. Eternal Warrior, 4 wounds and a massive hammer. His rules arnt shabby either.
Crowe seems to be better now, I’ll even put money on Crowe to beat Abaddon. Maybe Gabriel Seth will do better Str 8 I-5 but no power weapon. But Capt Tycho maybe the dark horse here. Capt stats and you get no armor save, the death company one sounds good to. But I hate the guy’s fluff. After reading it I don’t know how the hell he can be called a marine. I may use his stat page but would have to use a different captain model and give him a new name.
I think Chaos Daemons a no-name herald of Slaanesh on a chariot with it’s strength buffed could be quite scary if you still get your Hammer of Wrath in the challenge. Weighs in at a stonking 75 points and on the charge you’d normally be looking at 7 x S5 I7 Rending attacks with measly toughness 4 but 5 wounds and eternal warrior. With the new chariot rules though there’s D6 S6 I10 attacks added on. That’s up to 13 attacks and I realise there’s maybe some contention on this but Hammer of Wrath, the hits are done at AP – but rending kicks in when you roll to wound and nothing says that doesn’t still happen.
You’d have to be phenomenally lucky but you could see 6 unsavable wounds at I10 and even that aside, taking an average of 10 attacks at I7 or over that’s pretty scary in my book.
Just remembered chaplain Cassius toughness 6 may work and even Kor’sarro Khan.
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