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FoW Late war Soviet army list – request for input

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This topic contains 2 replies, has 2 voices, and was last updated by  limburger 1 month ago.

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  • #1577349

    limburger
    14791xp
    Cult of Games Member

    I’m trying to build a Soviet army list using the Bagration book as a starting point.
    Goal is to build something that has a narrative that works for me and isn’t too weird, non-historical, or just a big ol’ mess.

    The narrative is an army using whatever equipment they’ve still got (or captured) taking the fight back to the Germans.

    I initially thought I’d start with the big Soviet box of goodies (aka ‘Heavy Assault group’ army pack), because who doesn’t like big guns ?
    This gives me access to :
    – 4 ISU-122/152 assault guns
    – 4 IS-2 tanks
    – 4 SU-76 light assault guns
    – 3 BA-64 armoured cars
    – 4  57mm/76mm guns (to be used as anti tank or artillery if I’m not mistaken)
    – 8 stands of standard infantry, machinguns, their kommissar and leader

    Two command cards peaked my interest :
    – ‘Partisan raid’ (a rifle company that can be deployed while counting as reserves as well as faster terrain move)
    – ‘Decoy  tank company’ (giving the option to field German Panzer IV, StuGs, Panthers or even a Tiger)

    A bit of tinkering in Forces.FlamesOfWar.com gives me this 140 point army :

    Bagration: Soviet

    Formation 1 : Recon Company with all the options
    = Reconnaissance Company
    = Reconnaissance Company HQ
    2x PPSh SMG team
    1x M3 Scout (.50 cal MG) (LS135), or Sd Kfz 251 (MG) (LS136)

    – Armoured Reconnaissance Platoon
    6x PPSh SMG team
    3x Sd Kfz 251

    – Armoured Reconnaissance Platoon
    6x PPSh SMG team
    3x Sd Kfz 251

    – 82mm Mortar Company
    9x 82mm mortar

    – 76mm Anti-tank Company
    4x 76mm gun

    – BA-64 Armoured Car Platoon
    3x BA-64 (MG)

    Formation 2 : Engineer-Sapper Battalion bringing in the big guns
    = Engineer-Sapper Battalion
    – Engineer-sapper Battalion HQ
    2x PPSh SMG team

    – Engineer-sapper Company
    8x PPSh SMG team with Smoke Pots

    – Engineer-sapper Company
    8x PPSh SMG team with Smoke Pots

    – ISU-122 Heavy SP Battery
    4x ISU-122 (122mm)

    Support
    = ZSU M17 Anti-aircraft Platoon (’cause it’s fun)
    3x ZSU M17 (Quad .50 cal MGs)

    = SU-76 Light SP Battery (waste not, want not)
    4x SU-76 (76mm)

    = Rifle Company (Partisan Band)
    15x DP MG & M1891 rifle team
    1x Komissar team

    Bagration: Soviet Command Cards
    = Partisan Band

    = Decoy Tank Company (German tanks captured by Soviets)
    3 Panzer IV (LG167)
    3 StuG (LG110)

    Overkill ?
    Probably

    Some things were picked because I liked them and some because they sort of were part of the boxed set I got already.
    To do : get more infantry …

    Questions :

    Am I being silly ? (I suppose so, but at least I resisted the temptation to field a Tiger :P)
    What can I change to make it less silly and maybe more historical correct ?

    I want to use as much of the ‘Heavy Assault’ box as possible while adding more infantry.

    I doubt I can win any tournaments with this list, but that isn’t important.

    Bagration may be a bit ‘too late’ for this specific idea, so feel free offer advice which I may or may not ignore.
    (at least I’m not adding flying saucers or werewolves …  :D)

    #1577804

    phaidknott
    4462xp
    Cult of Games Member

    I’d say that’s a very “unhistorical” list (but perfectly fine within the FoW list building systems).

     

    The “engineer/sapper” units with body armour are basically fictional (as the troops refused to wear it in the field as it was too heavy, and you couldn’t run around in the things).

    The “decoy” tank company, again a bit fictional from Battlefront. Captured tanks were used during the war (mainly just PZer IIIs and Stug IIIs after the battle of Stalingrad), but mainly either to provide “tracks” for a Russian conversion (such as the SU76i), or perhaps as a specific tactic of sending just a couple of tanks in at the front of a column to cause confusion (but only momentarily), but almost never in formations as large as a tank company.

     

    The “big box” set is fine “if” you wanted to play the Battle of Berlin only (the IS-2s where only around for that in any numbers).

    But the main reason it’s a non-historical listing is that you’ve omitted THE most common tanks in the field (T34s), and your “basic” infantry is in a minority vs the special/elite FoW troop types. As I said previously your list is fine working within the confines of the FoW gaming system and/or for tourney play. But for a more historical list I’d go big on the T34s (in 1945 at least 1/3rd were still T34/76s), and on basic infantry. Then I’d look to adding an assault gun (ISU 122) unit as more late war flavour.

     

    Alas as an “historical” force the latest box from Battlefront isn’t the best (but then it’s not the first time they’ve done this in favour of releasing a more FoW/Tourney friendly selection). The SU-76s are fine (used throughout the  mid and late war periods), as are the towed artillery options. But the ISU and IS tank options really limit you to the last days of the war (while the BA64s are more mid war). So the box options in a historical context are a bit off a mess.

     

    You could go for the massed T34 box set instead (and strike fear into your opponent with sheer numbers) if you really want to buy one of the big boxes (same price as the one you picked but with 24 T34s in it 😀 )? It’s a bit silly for numbers (but a handy purchase to split with another gamer or two , as 8 or 12 is a much more reasonable number for on the table top)

     

     

     

    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by  phaidknott.
    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by  phaidknott.
    #1577951

    limburger
    14791xp
    Cult of Games Member

    @phaidknott thanks for the info. I suspected it wasn’t ‘historical’ 😀

    // Engineer/Sapper

    I think the ‘Engineer/Sapper’ company box has the same submachine gun armed infantry units as the other Soviet infantry boxes for v4 late war soviets.  It’s the unit card that claims they have ‘body armour’.

    I read he ‘body armour’ rule (which only gives a 1/6 chance to not die in an assault) as them simply having a bit more experience in dodging bullets while closing in for the assault.
    It also shows one of the problems with a D6 system as there is very little you can change without introducing potential silly or overpowered rules.

    // ‘decoy’ tank company …
    yeah, I agree.  That’s why I think I will pick just a few StuGs or Panzer IV’s to use as a distraction and a hobby challenge.
    I doubt they could use Tigers when even the Germans had problems keeping those things running …

    // more standard infantry and/or loads of T34’s…
    I was kind of trying to avoid the T34 horde and wanted to create a more infantry focussed army with interesting/cool support units.
    In hindsight having both Engineers and Recon in a single army is a bit overkill.
    I still want an excuse to use either of them as they are kind of cool.

    // — edit —
    ‘official’ listbuilding advice from Battlefront :
    https://www.flamesofwar.com/hobby.aspx?art_id=7145

     

    • This reply was modified 1 month ago by  limburger.
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