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Ignition Core Games Is Teasing…Relic Knights?

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This topic contains 14 replies, has 5 voices, and was last updated by  limburger 1 week, 4 days ago.

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  • #1912962

    senjimakoto
    Participant
    1377xp

    So this was not something I was expecting on seeing any company announce, short of an official “Going Out of Business” post from Ninja Division.

    ICGRK

    Ignition Core Games shared that image on the Relic Knights’ Facebook page as well as their own website. No other information beyond the February 4th announcement and something about Adepticon 2025.

    I am not sure how I feel. I was one of the 2,300+ backers that were left high-and-dry with the Kickstarter back in 2017. It goes without saying that Ignition Core Games would have no responsibility to the previous backers, so I’m not expecting anything. Additionally, with the sheer number of new miniature games that have populated the landscape in the last few year, I’m not exactly sure how well an IP has toxic as Relic Knights will fare.

    That all be said, should certainly be interesting to see. Of course, all the best luck to them.

    #1912963

    grantinvanman
    2302xp
    Cult of Games Member

    I always wonder, “what happens when a KS doesn’t fulfill – do they company owners walk away with the money?” ; if so, the IP has to be sold on, right?

    Isn’t there an obligation when buying an IP that the KS debt is satisfied?

    I honestly don’t know.

     

    #1912975

    sundancer
    43163xp
    Cult of Games Member

    KS is an investment. You hand over money to someone, trusting they will deliver.

    How I read KS ToS: if you do a funding event and meet your goal you must at least try to make it happen. And if it fails (for what ever reason) it just doesn’t happen. No one needs to sell of their IP.

    And no: buying an IP does not come with an obligation to fulfil anything outstanding unless that is part of the deal when someone sells the IP. (When a company is sold, that’s a different beast with outstanding debts etc.)

    If you can prove that the maker of the KS has fraudulently taken your money and just ran with it (example: never really planned to do the project) you can sue them but you still don’t get any money back from KS.

    When a KS reaches it’s goal, the money goes to the creator and backers will have to sit and wait and hope for the best.

    It’s an investment. Not a pre-order.

    That all being said: depending on local rights and laws you still might be able to crack down on someone. But I highly doubt that that will bear any fruit.

    #1912977

    grantinvanman
    2302xp
    Cult of Games Member

    Thanks @sundancer for that. I have been very much against KS and this just clarifies why I shouldn’t “invest” in something that might not come to fruition. I suppose I prefer that old school pre-order style of purchase, rather than the hope and pray of investing. I was, randomly, an investment executive at one point in my career. I never did like the risk side of the equation; stocks, bonds, derivatives – I still prefer the “sure thing”. It’s funny how psychology works on the money side of the brain, eh?

    #1912979

    sundancer
    43163xp
    Cult of Games Member

    you just got to look on what KS was set out to do: enable people to create new stuff that wouldn’t get funding from anywhere else. Simple example in our hobby:

    Company wants to make injection plastic sprue models. They know (or have a good estimate) on what tooling will cost. They can estimate how much material will cost. All costs added up divided by the target price of a sprue is the minimum they need to make to get the thing off the ground without loosing money. Add a generous overhead for fees, production problems and rise in material costs and you know what you KS goal is and how much you’ll charge the backers per sprue. That’s an easy one.

    But then companies make mistakes. Stretch goals that aren’t well calculated and add more cost than they thought. Or even worse: setting the goal lower than what they need just to have the badge “funded in 24h” only to be left with less money than they need. And at that point such KS go down the drain. If you need 100k but you set your goal to 10k and end up with 50k you’re 50k short.

    And then there is shipping and taxes and laws and what not.

    Yeah, KS is a nice way to get things off the ground but you really need to look at the details for every project.

    #1912982

    grantinvanman
    2302xp
    Cult of Games Member

    I guess KS only works when the people behind the project are REALISTIC and knowledgeable with their business model? Shorting yourself 50k but still funding (technically!) in 24h isn’t good business – and I think that’s where I, as an investment educated person, feel KS is a non-starter. There’s WAY better risks that will yield dividends than KS. To me, anyway.

    As usual, your kilometrage may vary…

    #1913028

    limburger
    21808xp
    Cult of Games Member

    I think kickstarter works best for companies that are realistic and need the additional visibility that comes with crowdfunding, especially within the tabletop hobby. Miniatures tend to be a pretty safe bet.

    STL files are ridiculously common, but I’d say there are dedicated platforms out there that would work as well.

    // —

    Several kickstarters have gone down a similar road before :

    – Orc Quest : picked up by Monolith, backers from previous kickstarters only needed to pay for shipping
    (they ran out of funding when they were close to finishing)

    – Evil Dead boardgame : picked up by Angry Joe and his team (I think), similar deal for backers of the kickstarter that never completed. However instead of the original boardgame this was a completely new game design.
    (AFAIK the original team ran out of funding because they underestimated how difficult producing a boardgame is when you don’t know what you’re doing and have to communicate with Chinese factory that apparently wasn’t making things easy.  Their last updates before the project died showed that there was a game and minis were being designed. I don’t know if fraud was proven … but it was pretty close)

    – Starfinder miniatures : after what felt like ages Archon Studios were gracious enough to send something to backers (I think Ninja Division and Archon weren’t agreeing on who or what needed to pay for things). I’d say they were the oldest example of a company digging a whole to fill another. Delays of a different project killed their cashflow and things escalated from there.

    So … there could be hope depending on what the new company wants to do.
    Relic had some good ideas, but the market is soo damned crowded that I doubt it will ever be anything other than a niche game.

    It’s good to see that the IP can be revived.

    https://www.ignitioncoregames.com/

    The website and catalog make me wonder if they are set up to deliver a game though. Existing catalog appears to be a game from another company. It could work for Relic if all they need is to create and ship the physical products.

    However they are USA based and the webshop indicates that they don’t really ship enough to get reasonable shipping prices (asking folk to email for a ‘better deal’ does not give me hope for this).
    As such I’d expect this not to be EU friendly … but we’ll have to wait and see.

    Heck .. it may be a one man band which will spell trouble if the kickstarter goes big.

    #1914151

    limburger
    21808xp
    Cult of Games Member

    Relic Knights is indeed coming back via crowdfunding.

    They are indeed announcing it at Adepticon 2025.

    Any sculpts in v1 format will be updated to v2 (I’m assuming that’s bringing them up to date where possible).

    Two options :

    – 50% MSRP discount, minis in retail packages with all associated unit cards, esper decks, etc. in print

    – ‘naked product’ : minis only, at factory cost. Rules etc as print&play.

    It is a reasonable offer, because we can’t exactly expect them to offer backers of the kickstarter anything at this point.

    — edit —

    No crowdfunding campaign. Straight to retail it is.

    • This reply was modified 2 weeks, 1 day ago by  limburger. Reason: updated after email from Ignition Core Games
    #1914170

    senjimakoto
    Participant
    1377xp

    I was making my way over here to share that. I just saw the email (after I struggled to remember which email account was my Kickstarter account lol).

    Given that they owe us anything, I think that both options are fantastic. Granted, the 50% will depend on how much they are bringing the game to market at. However, I’d happily give anyone that isn’t Ninja Division more money to get what I originally backed.

    #1914199

    limburger
    21808xp
    Cult of Games Member

    I have already considered the original kickstarter to be a lost cause, so while the options are interesting I wouldn’t mind supporting the new kickstarter. I’ve emailed them and told them as much while also asking for more details and possible deadline for that offer.

    The worst aspect is that they’re launching when there’s multiple games of that kind of size out there. When the original kickstarter was launched it didn’t have a lot of competition.

     

    #1914265

    limburger
    21808xp
    Cult of Games Member

    @senjimakoto I got an answer to my email :

    This will not be a crowdfunding project. The Relic Knights backers don’t deserve to go through another wait. I’m front loading the risks and funding production from my own limited business funds. When the doors open at Adepticon I will be carrying inventory.

    The first item from the Kickstarter that I will have in stock is the RK2.0 two player starter. The will be a few Radiant and Void models that weren’t in the Kickstarter campaign too. The press release will announce those models and give a release schedule after that.

    Exact prices are still being determined but bar napkin math right now puts the Radiant vs Void starter (box contains 12 minis, two Esper decks, unit cards) at:

    MSRP $99
    KS backer Discount amount $50
    Minis only KS backer amount $20

    The deadline will most likely be six months past the date each product becomes available for purchase. I also can make case by case exceptions to the deadline, but those would be based on a backer not finding out on time (like if my email went to their spam folder).

    tl;dr;

    No crowdfunding but straight to retail at Adepticon 2025 with new releases as updated sculpts get released.

     

    #1914649

    ushancat
    Participant
    3xp

    Hey all! Heriberto From Ignition Core games here! The final press release is out here: https://www.ignitioncoregames.com/post/relic-knights-is-back and if you’ve got anything you want to ask Will (the owner of ignition core games) We’ll both be streaming this next sunday. We actually did that last time and the VOD is still up at My Twitch account (User name: Ushancat)

    We’ll be there this next sunday. Stream starts at 6:00 but will joins us at 8:00 pm. (Texas time!)

     

    Cheers!

    #1914651

    sundancer
    43163xp
    Cult of Games Member

    Hey CGL, take note, this is how you treat your customers. Well done @ushancat

     

    For the lazy gits:

    The VoD in question

    https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2370967489

    The press release:

    https://www.ignitioncoregames.com/post/relic-knights-is-back

    #1914652

    ushancat
    Participant
    3xp

    Credit Definitely Goes to Will and thanks! I’m involved with Ignition core Mostly with the namesake game (Ignition Core) as the sculptor, and Magical Girl Assault as the designer and sculptor.

    Will is an honorable dude and he’ll do his best.

    #1914654

    limburger
    21808xp
    Cult of Games Member

    It will be interesting to see if it regains momentum again.

    With designs dating back almost a decade there’s bound to be stuff that isn’t quite fit for ‘modern audiences’ as there’s quite a bit of *eh* anime boobage (if I were to label the style), but otoh it lends it its own charm and makes it unique which is important in a crowded space.

    I know I want the starterset, but other than that … who knows. IT will depend on the timing of releases.

    I do hope there’s a chance of a local-ish retailer in the EU (or UK) somewhere along the line.

     

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