Weekender: HoloLens – Augmented Reality Tabletop Gaming?
January 31, 2015 by dignity
We're back with another bumper episode of The Weekender where we're kicking things off by checking out the new Harlequins that have popped up from Games Workshop for Warhammer 40,000. As well as that a whole bunch of Eldar arrived in the studio!
As well as that we get into augmented reality and the new Microsoft HoloLens that was announced. It's a cool toy for the computer but imagine what it could do for tabletop gaming! It would be awesome to see overlays and more popping up around our models.
Justin also finally gets to talk about Homeland from Gale Force Nine and take us through some of the rules and how it plays.
Some of you might also have noticed that Angel Giraldez's Masterclass Volume I is causing a bit of a stir! It's up for pre-order on Monday and you get the very nice Joan of Arc model if you do as well!
Have a great weekend of gaming!
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Welcome to the Weekend!
its my understanding that motley doesn’t have to be diamonds.it can be strips, checks, different colored threads, etc.
Great show, defiantly think the hololens will change the things on the tabletop (eventually). maybe it could allow for destroyable terrain or your vehicles to appear wrecked once they have been shot.
Hololens – I think Gen 3 or 4 is more likely to have the sort of capabilities you are hoping for but since generations of tech come through much more quickly now, the wait will not be over long.
Harlequins – meh.
I agree we’ve got several iterations to wait. 1st gen is capable of a basic scan of the environment and overlaying (augmenting) images. To get to the point where the glasses can scan at a resolution fine enough to identify individual real world objects like miniatures is a long way away.
Games like Minecraft, Space Hulk – maybe even Total War augmented on a flat table top is the best we can hope for in the first few generations.
Combine this with something like Surface with RFID chips in your models and we might have the hybrid you seek.
The hololens would be great for doing D&D games creating your own 3d dungeons or later on virtual tables so you can create say jungle environments which you can add your minis into
It’s the weekend… Time to kick back and watch an hour of a bunch of guys talking bo###cks… My kind of bo###ocks mind you! Don’t stop!
I’m presuming this was shoot before the quins plastic pictures were released; they’re very different (cr@p) compared to the previous metals!
I really do hope we aren’t returning to the days of discussing every new GW release. If it’s new and ground breaking then go for it, but another 40K release, nah. Your strength is in the diversity of the games you talk about, don’t be sucked back in!
That said, the rest of the show was very good; Homeland the Game looks a bit flat as a board game (and I don’t mean through a lack of vertical build to the game). Especially when you had just been talking about the latest technological marvel that we will be ruining our eyesight with. but could be really cool in the process…..I’m surprised that it took so long for the remote virtually enhanced gaming solution (playing your mate who’s somewhere else) to be thought of in the show, way to go Justin
Not going to be something in every show no but since it was the Harlequins and they’re quite an interesting part of the Warhammer 40,000 world we thought it was worth talking about their return 🙂
BoW Ben
Great weekender, so nice to have the guys (Lloyd, Sam, Justin and John) getting a chance to actually talk, give an opinion, and not be completely steam rollered after just a couple of words.
Keep the good work up!
Lol
I still think you’re great Warren, you got me into Beasts of war……but your like a force of nature sometimes, well most of the time!
Best regards and great respect!
currently fighting the forces of nature.
I’m not so sure about the no-steamrolling! Poor Sam barely could get a word in edgewise! The other two were released from their shackles and went nuts! LOL
I managed to get a pre-order through for the book!
Good show… that hololens looks cool… but I fear due to the laziness of people it could have the opposite effect on our hobby as more and more tech is used less and less scenery will be used then swap out the mini’s and boom you have just another computer game.
I work with augmented reality most days at work. If anyone’s still struggling to get their head around it head over to our site http://www.newmoongames.co.uk (think there’s a link to it in my signature thing).
Speaking as someone who knows how the current generation of AR tech works it looks like the big leap with HoloLens is that it can keep the environment stored in memory. Whereas currently we have to have a marker to let the software know where the flat surfaces are.
IF they’ve got software that can scan the environment AND keep your head tracked within that environment REGARDLESS of where you are, then it could be awesome.
If you tried to do that now you’d lose the marker when you turned your head and all the AR disappears.
The whole tech depends on one thing really – the unit’s ability to accurately scan the environment. If you have a table with a mug on it for example, can the software work out that the mug shouldn’t be there and ignore it for the purposes of making a primitive shape to be used in the simulation? If it can’t then it’ll build a cylinder primitive where the mug is. Which would complicate the simulation and add an extra object you don’t necessarily move. You’d basically have to go round and make sure everything in your home is spotless like in the promo videos so the scanner can work properly.
No doubt we’ll end up with a pair of these at some point and we’ll develop for them. I’ve set myself a mini mission at work – to try and steer us towards developing for (physical) games companies. I haven’t managed to find a way to contact them yet but when I do… I’d love to do AR work for the hobby I love 🙂
Just preordered the book its a must have. Cant wait for those glasses either always wanted to dig a big hole in my living room floor
Great show guys. I am waiting for the Mr Giraldez book 🙂
“zee”?
Harrumph, you kids of today.
I can see AR being a useful tool in tabletop RPGs, but possibly not so much for tabletop wargaming
I do wonder how well people that need actual glasses to see benefit from HoloLens because clearly those were made in people that don’t need glasses in mind like lot of products.
Here is one I did, I just restricted the diamonds to one trouser leg to minimize effort 😉
here is another view of my harlequin dude.
That’s really cool. Totally gets the image accross without having to paint too many tiny diamonds!
Thanks man 🙂
now i want the book also 🙁
The Pathfinder Adventure Card Game is a good lunch time game based on my experience playing with a group of 5 other people. Even though none of them had played before, we still got through the game in an hour.
That said, you need to be organised; everyone needs to pick their character and make up their starting deck ahead of time (you only have to do it once.. unless the character dies of course) and you need to build up the location decks before the game if you want to keep the play time tight.
Hololens sounds great, but do you remember when Microsoft teased about kinnect? I would take this with a grain of salt, but you actualy described how Golem Arcana works, you tap the figure and his stats appear etc, its just on a flat display… 50 inch in my case 😉
In larger scales ( 1/35 ) some complicated camo patterns come as a decal sheet for those of us who get bug eyed painting modern digital or pea dot cam , etc . Might be an idea for some one to release several patterns / colors of the harlequin’s motley . Although getting the pattern of diamonds and squares all running the same way might be a problem . Great show as usual guys
screw motley.
I painted some Harlequins up in red and black with gold details and they look good AND stand out from the other Eldar on the table.
Lloyd, the show you are remembering is called……wait for it……Treasure Island in Outer space”!!! From 1987 was 5 episodes of 100mins each and it was AWESOME!!! I also remember watching it during the summer holidays.
Lloyd I think this was the program you were talking about if I remember half of the series was in black & white?
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0179577/
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x13lkjw_treasure-island-in-outer-space-1987-part1_shortfilms
Good show guys, I am not so sold that hololens will make a huge impact, and certainly not for a number of years – it has potential but I think a number of advances in the technology will be needed and it will be very dependent on ease of access for developers to modify for our niche industry. I also think that, it’s not something everyone will want to employ – I am certainly not sold by the initial ideas. Also price point will be the thing, love @stew‘s idea for D&D but it would required a whole part to have the headsets.
Harlequins I have commented on, which I have some reservations on modelwise, nice to see them back though rumours are more and a codex to follow – I wonder if the mimes will return?
party not whole part – edit function please chaps
Hololens looks awesome.
I’m surprised no one mentioned gaming effects for the hololens glasses. How cool would it be to see a tank blow up and leave a burning wreck, or for your sorcerer to shoot out a big purple flame and grill someone?
As for lunch games Race for the Galaxy is a great card game, works beautifully for two. It’s a bit heavy on the symbols when you’re learning it (a blue circle with a red edge is different to one with a black edge) but really quite fast when you know it. 30 minutes or so for a game.
“your sorcerer to shoot out a big purple flame and grill someone” woo, that sounds like holo lens porn!
RFID tags or similar in unit bases to assist with unit recognition for the hololens?
Starting to really enjoy this site! With regards to painting super-diamonded costumes on Harlequins it couldn’t be easier……..
Decals! Find or make a design, nice bright basecoat, print onto thin decal paper and robert is your mothers-sisters-husband. Use decal thinner. Plenty of real printers will make you a sheet if you ask really nice.
Hope this is of some use. D.x
Happy Sunday,
Really enjoyed the show this week. Lloyd you look like you have had some sleep! You are back to your lively self.
With regards to the Hololens at first I thought there are huge possibilities for this and my husband and I had some great conversations around this. However he said he could change my mind and make me hate the idea with one comment. “With the Hololens, my Katana or A.I can now have a physical look, she can be whatever I want her to be programmed to have an emotional response to me, one more step in replacing the real thing – You.” He’s right – I hate that idea. Lol
Then I asked “Would you really like an Artificial intelligence?” His response “I would just like some intelligence in my partner” lol I am doomed!
We have been having this discussion for weeks, A.I being the replacement for real relationships in the near future. There was an article that we read about Japanese young men who are not leaving their rooms, but having virtual relationships online with both A.I and real Avatars. There are negative aspects to everything, and I think with the Hololens this could be one. Not ever leaving your house to explore the real world. When you can have it in the virtual world.
As a woman, I think the potential for these A.I relationships is a terrible thing. From my perspective it feels like we as a gender will be replaced. However it can go both ways, women only wanting relationships with their perfect A.I mate…..will this be the end of human kind??
On the flip side – being able to create a D&D table with this would be fantastic!!! Take a lot of work – but might be fun.
I would love to hear what you all think?
Great articles in this show guys. The glasses look good spacehulk or the new alien’s game would be great it you don’t die of a hart attack that is when the genestealer / alien gets you. Homeland looks good as well; the book would just make me stop painting because I would look at the instructions then look at my model and think nope that don’t look the same just (like the advert with the guy making a ladybird cake).
Here is my take on the tech…Think of it as a monitor but in three dimensions.
Everything you do in a PC can be done in the virtual world. Zbrush is a pretty simple port over. Animated games where your troops run around get shot, bleed, fall over… Everything you can get in a PC game. it all comes down to programming.
Long term, the death of physical minis for the war game market. The only use at all for minis is in a fashion like the Disney figures that are used with the console to unlock the toon in the program.
Just my opinion, but the hobby part may still exist but it will be for the sake of hobby alone. The actual play will not remain the same it this takes off.
I also think it will move faster than you might expect. all the keys to the tech are now there, they just need refinement. The missing part has always been the ability to interface with a real world space. If the previews are accurate, then this ‘could’ be a reality within the next 5-8 years. JMO….
the art book looks very tempting….
Romans you say……..
Hololens excitement is incredibly premature. I recall the promos microsoft put out for the Kinect system and it looked incredible, allowing you to do things previously unheard of with your console.
Reality however proved that it wasn’t quite as versatile or user friendly as those promos made it appear.
Promo: Guy walks into room says Xbox turn on. Xbox switches on greets guy. Guy says Xbox play last night’s football game. Football game begins as guy sits down to relax.
Reality: You walk into the room, you say xbox turn on….you wait a bit…XBOX turn on…..a little longer….XBOX TURN ON!!!! Beep as you press the power button. Now where’s the blasted remote.
Justin, you are a true Otaking! 😉 And yes, this is truly a great thing, i truly love augmented reality.
But what puts me on the line is this will end up being another reason for people to end up separated in their homes forever, because they don’t have to move anymore, they can stay forever in their home doing their hobby and playing with anyone, no matter if that person is next door, just because is easy to do it that way rather than moving your stuff.
It will be killing human relationships and end up living with on the internet even when you are not in front of your pc… Believe me when i said i live in internet… and that was why i got in to wargaming… i want to find other fellow nerds face to face, paint together, play and have fun with it… rather the screen eating me forever…
Maybe I’m getting old but I find I’m just not that excited about the wargaming applications of augmented reality. I’m with @vondrasky, I like my wargaming to happen in person, the smell of the books, the feel of the plastic, the gentle clack, clack of the dice on the table (woah, that got weird, sorry!).
Video games on the other hand, I’m totally on board!
Not sure your idea about people taking pics of them doing the Jammy dance and sending them in such a good thing. Some of us actually sleep in the buff. The whole thing could become very unpleasant over time, so you lads just might want to rethink this one! For Example; A 16 stone, hungover, all over bodily-haired guy in his stained jocks n socks, dancing and waving round a laptop with BOW logo on the screen might not be the kind of thing you guys need to see. Or the rest of us for that matter…..
You are asking about identifying things. It is easy, RFID tags. They are cheap enough now as long as you add an RFID reader to the glasses or a wand of some sort, it would be able to identify the object without having to somehow be able to ID the whole 3d image. Especially with something like Orks where my Battlewagon may look way different than your Battlewagon.
I have just purchased the 7TV game pdf. I don’t play mini games (x-wing doesn’t count IMO). But 60’s/70’s TV adventures…
Oh dear. “Anything could happen in the next half hour!”