DZC Starter Set… The Best In The Industry?
August 14, 2013 by warzan
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Let’s face it, GW hasn’t really innovated in their starter experience in a long time. The sculpts for the individual minis keep getting better but the package feels less complete. Remember the Maccrage set that had terrain in it? It wasn’t a lot of terrain, but it was something, and it was usable either as difficult terrain, obstacles or objectives. The new sets have higher production values in printed material, and some really good sculpts, but they feel less like a starter set and more like just another box of minis every with every redesign.
PP is the same way (as much as I like them). Malifaux too. I think a lot of starter sets are designed with the idea that you’ll be playing at a store with other people who are already playing. The materials kind of support brand new players at home, but that’s not really the audience their targeting.
And in the end, it’s about audiences as much as it about product. I think also though that some games are more reliant on terrain than others, and those games are becoming more common now. DZ really needs buildings. The terrain is an integral part of the game so it would be foolish for them to try and present it without making allowances for that. And since the terrain is basically boxes, it’s an easy thing to make in affordable cardstock.
Infinity, Carnevale and Malifaux would all benefit from including some buildings in a starter set. MERCs kind of does a half measure by including some terrain on cards in each set of cards. Wyrd really should form a tighter partnership with Worldworks to get some of those terraclips sets (or mini sets) included in starter boxes. They have the product sitting right there, I really don’t feel like they’re utilizing it to its fullest potential.
Very true! They could ship the Buildings of Malifaux set with a double-sided 4×4 paper mat drawn from WWG’s existing art with the Himmelveil Streets on one side and Deadfall on the other.. or perhaps a 50/50 mix of Buildings and the ground tiles from Streets. As part of a two gang starter set it would certainly help to ship a few copies of M2E!
Honestly, I think they should just commission a special set of single building terraclips that can each fit inside one of their existing starter boxes.
Think of it. The Lady Justice box has one building in it. The Whitechapel box has a different (resurrectionist-themed) building in it. Each starter has one building and just enough clips to hold it together. The one little box is pretty simply on its own but is also completely compatible with the rest of the terraclips range.
They could increase the price of the starter boxes, and people would pay. People would start buying the boxes just to get the unique building each one contains. They’d probably have to collect them all together into one special edition terraclips set just to address that demand.
Yeah that’s actually pretty smart! Too bad that things have been so quiet over at WWG this year.. 🙁
GW’s starter sets are still pretty impressive. In fact, in many ways they are the best things they do – a rulebook, dice, other bits and bobs, plus plenty of really good miniatures is excellent…excellent..kaff…kaff…sorry, it’s just sticking in my throat a little…excellent value. How often, these days, can one end a sentence about GW with those words?
That said, other companies are starting to offer comparatively impressive starter sets – and follow-up minis that don’t require you sell a kidney to afford them.
i think flames of war vietnam needs a starter set similar to open fire
I agree completely. If they did a ‘Nam set to the standard of Open Fire I’d buy at least 2.
Plenty of people I know end up buying the GW start box for the small rulebook. They buy the kit and then sell/trade the models. I find the difference with the GW vs FoW starters is that you can buy the FoW starter many times over and continue to grow two or three different army lists but there is a finite amount of times with the GW kit. Not something many do, but I know more folks that buy multiples of the FoW kit vs only one or two that would buy even one of the GW starter for more than just the rules. eh.
I agree starter sets are often the first impression people have for a game.
Plus for Dropzone the great value for the starter can help offset the perceived expense of the game (I know for a fact that its what has stopped half of my local group from picking up the game).
It would be awesome if the other 2 factions got a box set in plastic but I don’t expect that too happen
Couldn’t agree more mate. This is an awesome value, and if HWG mirrored that quality with a PHR/Shaltari starter I might have to put off buying my new PC… and car… Seriously though, it’s genuinely pleasing to see a company which so conveniently aligns it’s products with my interests.
Think my favorite starter set was the second edition 40k one, had everything you needed, even card scenery.
Very true – that was the box that got me started down this path many years ago! 🙂
This was a smart move on their part as well as a needed tool to get people interested. As said by @kombine most people I know that where hyped up about the game fell silent once they saw the price tag for a single starter set. I might get into the game now that they have it more affordable.
I loved the flames of war starter set and was impressed in the fact that not only did you get a shed load of minis, but also some very basic terrain (almost enough of a whole board). Ok it may have only been flat tree bases etc, but far better than anything GW has put out in the past. I like the look of the DZC set, although it doesn’t have as many minis as the FOW one, this seems balanced by the terrain etc. Both companies seem to care about their customers offering you all you need out of one box! really impressed and will have to get myself a DZC set at payday, (think i’ll get my employer just to pay my wages direct to toy shops in the future, saves on me being the middle man!!)
See if you can get that as a pre-tax paycheck deduction. I’m tempted to try that once in a while.
This reminds me of the first two Epic boxed sets. 2 opposing forces and best of all, terrain. This is what sets this box apart. The fact that I can put this stuff together and have a nice looking battle in no time. Hobby time is often in short supply and this is just what’s required – even more so than having two forces in plastic (though I might have felt differently if there were any post-humans in the box :)).
I would like to see Wyrd bring out a two player starter set and as previously said containing terrain etc.
I also feel that Infinity and carnevale would benefit from a 2 player box. Carnevale in particular suffers from lack of terrain support which I think makes it dificult to get people interested in. I have had two carnevale starter sets since release that I haven’t played with yet.
I do think other companies need to up their game with 2 player sets after recent years and even more so since the release of open fire and dropzone.
Unfortunately GW has always set the tone for industry standard and other companies, up till now, have been in the shadow of the GW machine. Companies “innovating” their box sets like Hawk will go far in my opinion as they are immersing you straight out of the box. The investment after the initial 2 player set is significantly reduced, as long as you are wanting to play one of the two armies in the box. Hawk have obviously looked at the open fire set and thought how to do it better and they have.
The difference between open fire and dropzone is not significant in numbers but massive in immersion and play ability out of the box. The main difference is terrain. open fire has 2d terrain and dropzone has the towers/streets. The cost impact on Hawk, i would imagine, isn’t that significant.
GW sit back and take note from open fire and dropzone, this is how it should be done!
Basically everyone has shown GW how its done , hope for their own good they drop prices and improve their quality before its too late
Prodos games can probably top this in the near future
Time for the haters of the DzC prices to shut up. This is by far the best starter set out there for style, appeal and cost. Everything being included makes this a no brainer purchase for my school club. I couldn’t believe my eyes when I saw £60, cheap as chips! Glad it doesn’t contain PHR as I would have cried for not waiting.
GW did a lot to the hobby. I still think that their starters are the best products you can find. However, DzC is a great starter. I think it has a great potential to gather a nice community of new comers (like me) to discover the system. FoW is also a starter that looks solid, I am not attracted by the WW2 as much as I could be with Irak war or futuristic. Anyway, well done DzC, I ll buy your starter… actually I ve already bought the rule book last week, just waiting for it to show up now ^^. carry one bringing more goodness on the table, and BoW, when are you guys doing a DzC’s week?
I remember Warhammer 40K second edition starter set, it contained miniatures, rules, Dices, terrain and a small Campaign to play. I Think its to bad that GW didnt continue to make starter boxes that way.
I will certanly take a look at the DzC starter
I have said many times before that GW should go back to doing what they used to do. I mean the old Epic 40k starter box was fantastic, it had armies terrian etc just like the Dropzone Commander set.
I must admit though I thought that the Open fire set couldn’t be beat on quality and value for money but I must agree that Dropzone Commander is the new kid on he block. So to any company wishing to produce a starter set in the future then I think for your product to do well you should look at these two sets.
I have been taken with Dropzone Commander ever since Beasts of War done varius spreads and videos on it, so after seeing it at Salute this year I was really interested in it. I do hope that Beasts of War look at doing a intro to the game as I think it will attract a lot of interest.
40K second and third also included the full rulebook, none of this half sized cut down rules only stuff, all of it, fluff and all.
I havent watched the unboxing video yet so I’ll take Warren’s word as to how good the starter is, but for me, GW SHOULD be miles ahead of the game in terms of best starters, they have th emost money , best model production facilities and by far the most experience of making starter boxes in the industry, that anyone is even close to competeing with them, let alone that many beat them for quality, is a travesty of inept business management that whomever is running product development at GW should be ashamed of.
My hope is that they have taken such a kicking with this edition of Fantasy that the next version of the boxset for 9th whenever it turns up will be an actual effort to regain marketshare, because if they put out the product they have the capability to do then it will be the best starter box in the business, and that means I have a great value for money set with fantastic minis in the best fantasy wargame there is.
Thats true, the old editions came with the big rulebook. I’ve started 40k with the box of the third edition and the box was okay with plastic miniatures, two ruins and a few trees. But there was one big problem – the Dark Eldar had no chance against the Marines. In every game just with the models in the box the Dark Eldar were killed.
A good starter set have to have two good and balanced armies and specially scenarios for the content of the box. What could be better with the DZC-Box? Well, I would love to see a beginners campaign – four or five connected scenarios with a short story and learning curve, something like a tutorial in PC-Games. Babylon 5: ActA had this with a Starter-Set – donÄt read all of the rules – just play and learn the rules for the scenario.
Seeing this box makes me really tempted to pick dropzone up!
Starter sets are the flagships for the respective games; it is so refreshing to see that there are good quality sets being put together for the prospective gamer. This increases the quality of future games, and keeps the emphasis on any company to keep proactive and offering the best to gamers. It is a good time to be a gamer!
The DUST Tactics Revised set is a great starter box especially for the price (if you can find it anymore) but this DZC Box looks awesome!
With the amount of new games on the scene this surely is the best way to build up a loyal customer base.
I’m sure we are going to see more and improved starter sets as new standards are set.
The original point behind the GW “starter” boxes was that they could be sold in toy stores alongside regular board games and be bought by parents to give to their children as gifts. They weren’t intended to allow them to compete in a crowded 21st century internet-driven minis market. Their role has subtly changed as they’re less concerned about getting into toy stores and more concerned about selling direct but the starter box role hasn’t fundamentally changed. It’s still a simple entry point a parent can buy their child when they first show an interest in playing.
As Warren touched on in his article, producing a starter box like this one is a considerable expense and is a major barrier to a company like Wyrd or Corvus Belli producing one. CB in particular would have to take a radical new direction with their minis production to be able to do it. I applaud Dave for taking the step of producing a starter box of this quality and I hope it pays off for him. I certainly intend on doing my bit.
Nice surprise to see this today, not really followed DZC so don’t know if this was expected on their forums etc but it was news to me. Also bit surprising not to see a set like this on Kickstarter, 3 new plastic sprues cant be cheap. Rest of the range must be doing quite well or they have an extremely rare and helpful bank manager. Either way Warren is right, really hard to find fault with it and I can see this taking the game to a LOT more players (including me). Well done Hawk and put me down for a copy 🙂
Dave kept the game under wraps for years until Salute last year and as far as I’m aware this starter set has come out of the blue as well. The only difference being that BoW rather than Salute are the platform for the announcement. It would seem as if this is the Hawk way of marketing, keep everything quiet until they’re close to release and then spring it on everyone.
Nice to have a good surprise once in a while. With the amount of leaks these days in the industry, a bit of the fun’s gone 😛
I’m so happy this came along. This is one of my favorite games, and the starter set has taken care of basically EVERYTHING for you! Nice work Dave, this is truly how you do it!
Bolt Action has a pretty good starter as well, but having this amount of high quality terrain to start with is surely a water devider.
Of all the starter sets I’ve seen over the years, the most memorable ones (and those I enjoyed the most) had terrain included. Since everything’s in the box, it’s easy to get stuck in.
And once you enjoy the game, it’s not like that will be your last purchase. Sure, quality starter sets are expensive to produce, but the payoff is an easier way to entice new players.
Yeah, @blackspiral totally agree about Dust.
Having a ‘board game’ separate but mechanically similar to the ‘wargame’ made it really easy to get into dust.
These DZC starters look so good. If they aren’t including the “Australia” tax in their prices, then I’ll pick up a copy for sure! At 60 pounds, it should be around $100 AUD. Under the “Australia” tax pricing international companies seem to use, that equates to about $150 because “that’s what the market will bear”. Seriously, DZC, undercut the market and you’ll make a serious push into Australia.
Thanks to BoW, my friend and I bougth 2 open fire sets, and we both love it.
DZC caught my eye a few months ago and maybe I will buy the starter set. Will BoW doe an unboxing about this set?
I would love a starter set of FoW ToD.
You mean like the video in the post above this post? 🙂
DZC starter box looks great. So to knock it off the top spot the next game needs to include the actual table too!
The terrain really does make this the perfect starter set, it makes me sad that I didn’t wait before buying the army set
This box makes it very easy to get into the game as the main comment from my local club has been on the price of the starter boxes for each faction. Now here’s a box that costs the same as one of them but comes with two factions starters, all the terrain you need to learn AND the full rulebook etc. Knocked it out of the park and a good benchmark for other companies to look at
I have to say that the best starter set ever created from my point of view is Necromunda, also the best skirmish game I have played ( I havent played them all). If GW were to redo a similar game, oh boy I m in!
I have a real objection to most starter kits. Myself and a friend both buy a starter kit, we divide the contants and have great games. However one of us does not get the army we realy want. But what if a third friend ( I do have three) wants to join in. She is out the expence of buying a starter faction at full price plus the book etc.
I much prefer the manner in which Mantic do things, with the rules in each of the £50 starter faction kits for each race. Some cardboard in the box, buildings, terrain, movement trays, and so on.
Is there a place in the market for an assmbely kit to go alongside the starters, which would contain nippers, file two glues,aa dozen paints, a score of dice and a tape measure.
Most non-GW/PP companies make their rules available for free, Hawk included, and they do starter boxes for each individual faction. It’s not like two-player starter boxes are the only entry point these companies are doing. They just fulfill an entry-point role that the one-player starters do not.
Someone mentioned terrain for Carnevale. It has just been released, and is part of their kickstarter. 3 separate buildings and a number of bridges.
Thats good to know!
The fact that you and a freind can split two boxes and end up with a full 6×4 table of terrain is fantastic.
For me, the great thing about the DzC starter set (apart from all the friggin cool stuff in the box) is that the price is cheaper than their starter armies (which are £68 each). The starter army price had put me off thinking about getting one, because, although it reflects the great work that’s gone into making the molds and then casting them, it’s a fair old whack to pay out when you’re just interested in trying it out.
Now that there’s this grrrreat box set with everything, truly everything, you need to play a game (ok, bar the tools to get them off the sprue, cleaned up and painted), I’m much more likely to consider getting it. Because even if I might not not enjoy some aspect of the game (I think that’ll be highly unlikely; the game looks like Aliens in Downtown NYC; who doesn’t want to play that!) I won’t have shelled out on a box that contains just one army and needs a rulebook to be bought in order to play the game.
@warzan If Dave gets to read this, how about suggesting to him the idea of having pedestrians? People running away down the streets with the UCM having to be wary of making LZ’s in the wrong place. Refugees who have to be rescued while the aliens are dropping in all around them.
I really do like the Dark Vengeance set, and bought it out of excitement to get something new, namely the Helbrute, proper-looking, and plastic, Deathwing, Chaos Cultists and more Dark Angel-themed Ravenwing bikes (and to have some minis that look as good as their metal or (without bubble defects) resin counterparts.
I think the emphasis was to put as much great looking new minis into the box as they can.
But, GW always seems to do the same thing recently, and that is they take a great step forwards with something, but then fall short of going all the way with it. In this box they could’ve put some card terrain in, like the 2nd Ed box, or a fold out 4×4 board, or sheets of printed card to stick onto a board! But no, instead, they give us whippy-sticks. So people view it more as a chance to buy the set for the mini rulebook and to swap their unwanted army with their friends, rather than view it as something new and exciting play.
And for people who are new to the game? Well what does the box cover suggest? Just two words: Dark Vengeance. So you might expect some, err, dark vengeful thing to do. You have to look at the back of the box to find out what type of game this is (possible design intention?). Otherwise, it’s a dull, boring box with a hint of something interesting to play.
I actually thought it was to cover for the Limited Edition boxed set with the Chaplain, and that the awesome artwork on the rulebook would be on the cover, but stupidly, it isn’t. Perhaps someone at GW thought that their tradition (and common sense) to put an amazing painting of the type of game people are going to buy that encapsulates the whole mood of the game, and gives an insight into the world people would be entering is old hat. One look at DzC proves that not to be the case at all.
The cover art of DzC puts you in no doubt as to what you’re getting into and the clue is in the cool name too, and one look at it makes one think ‘I want to play that, I want to be a Dropzone Commander!’. And Open Fire! is the same. There should have been more purpose put into the cover of Dark Vengeance; a reason to want to buy it. But more so than that, those little extras that DzC has in it’s boxed game which allows you to have a full, and rich experience of the game, that puts you in the environment of the DzC world, is something that GW and other companies should try to emulate.
Now please send me a free copy of DzC. Lol! Joking, joking (not really joking, but still joking). Can I haz? 😀
Absolutely have to +1 this.
The price point is really well selected, and you get quite a force to start with.
As a 40K player, I’m looking forward to playing a game where flyers can interact usefully with the game. I’m also liking the talk I’m hearing about how balanced the game is, and how infantry are powerful, but can’t just stand in the open and run head-long at the enemy.
It will be a great change from 40k, and a good game to mix it up with.
While the DZC models always looked great, the starter kits weren’t available readily in Australia, and besides that they were expensive and you needed two. I can buy this box, and play it with a friend without having to convince someone else to part with their hard-earned money. It also means I’ll get some good basic units, instead of ending up with a bunch of cool looking resin models that don’t function well together.
One problem with the GW starters, is they aren’t necessarily good starting armies. Chaos in DV gets cultists as the only troop choice, a “hellbrute” (meaning a dreadnought that can’t take upgrades) with perhaps one of the least popular weapon options, a chaos lord on foot (yawn) and an overpriced unit of chosen who will die really quickly. In terms of points, in terms of models you’ll use in a balanced army, DAs are in a far better position. If anything, the starter box should have included more points of chaos stuff, to try and lure beginners who don’t know any better to chaos to try and rebalance the horrible imperial marine bias of 40k players.
The Drop Zone Commander Starter is going to be hard to beat – two playable armies that don’t leave you feeling cheated. The FOW starter also has two playable armies that leave the buyer with a positive impression but.where DZC does score is in the terrain provision – a ready made 3D battlefield over which the two armies can fight.
I have the FoW Open Fire set and its well worth the money. I have the Dark Vengeance box set too, and it isn’t anywhere near as good. Yes models are great but I think you get more for your money in the FoW starter. I think both the bolt action and the dropzone commander boxes look so much better value for money then the GW one.
Just my opinion!
i think that the hobbit starter box was very good. OK lets face it its not as good 40k,fow, malifaux, or hordes. but it really feels like it has every thing, rules, dice measuring stick lots of terrain than can be put together in lots of different ways for the starter scenarios. the minitures are nice (except the goblins). i have just started playing hordes and i really like the games and the miniatures however would it kill pp to include some cardboard templates and tokens in there battle group boxes. i haven’t seen fow starter box but i have seen it on bow and it looks very good.
what a great looking set of terrain
This set is really raising the bar for beginner sets. It kinda takes me back to the 40k 2nd ed box which was possibly the first and last proper starter set GW’s did, (although saying that Magragge was a pretty desent set). What made it great was that it was pretty much a game in box, much like DzCs latest offering with loads of cardboard ruins that all linked into a scenario/ campaign. Ah the good old days….
But yeah great job Hawk!
The new Open Fire is an excellent product. Airfix still do starter sets which are fine. Spartan Games have most of there races in their games as box sets which are very good.
I recently a US and a German starter sets for Bolt Action just adding some 4Ground buildings and ruins some of which came as sets to get me going
Yeah, the recent GW starters have all left me a bit cold given how focused they are on just the (admittedly very pretty) minis, when if any company should be able to slap at least a couple of pieces of nice scenery in to liven up the initial experience it’s the lads from Lenton.
That DZC starter is awfully pretty though. And if nothing else the scenery will be serving double duty both for games of DZC and for games of Robotech RPG Tactics once it arrives 😉
I have to say, DZC terrain map is a fantastic idea but the building set are old time GW school, if anyone remember Space Marine 2nd edition or Epic 40.000, it’s the scale who demands it! Building for 6-10 mm are a must have and the table top looks so much nicer with them.
But i have to say, all in all, i still prefer Open Fire! (which i bought online and i am waiting to receive), playing with cardboard terrain is not excellent but it’s a perfect introduction for the whole wargaming experience.
Big cheers to DZC but for me open fire is still number one.
and in my opinion the best ever starter set is still Epic 40.000, second place Titan Legion, still best deal armies/content/price
I’d given Dropzone a miss before this starter set appeared, there’s something infectious about Warren’s enthusiasm though! Having watched the video with my “ooh shiny shiny” goggles on it was rude not to order a set immediately. Can’t wait!
The FoW starter sets pretty cool IMO.
I like the fact its a full sized rulebook in the starter, bolt action did the same and it makes the starter much more valuable, as the game grows an A5 rulebook would still be a nice addition as well.
I’d say dzc 2 player starter is the best all rounder due to the experience it will give you with no other purchases, which for getting newbies into the industry would be great except its not in every high street like Gw. As a hobby we need things like dreadball to be in the shops so as to expose more people to the hobby in a one box pick up and play boardgame format.
But back on topic I’d say dzc, open fire, warmachine 2 player starter and dust tactics starter boxes are the best 2 player options. As for 1 player starters I think the industry needs to look at warmachine/hordes starters and especially Eden. Eden includes full rules(not shortened rules like others) templates, tokens, cards and miniatures for little expense. I’m a big fan of starters, as you get to put a toe into a system for little risk.
Best overall starter period.
I like the Open Fire starter box set. I think that the starter box sets are important draw card for a particular company to bring new players in. It should provide enough miniatures, a themed rulebook (perhaps some missions too) to draw the players into the world. I would love to see a Dystopian Wars starter box set!
Dropzone starter set makes me want to get involved. All that kit for £60. You can’t beat it!