Infinity: Defiance Week – Upgrading Your Characters
October 30, 2019 by crew
In this video we're going to be looking at the Experience Trees available to the heroes in Infinity: Defiance as Corvus Belli talk us through the different choices you can make when upgrading your characters between games plus how this affects the spaceship too!
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I like the idea of cards for progression. Been enjoying Core Space but it’s a lot of paper shuffling (especially with beer) checking what a symbol allows you to do.
oh yeah that is one thing that keeps me wanting to play Core Space, im glad they have the upgrade system here as well
I’m gonna make index cards that each have a different thing on them, that was we don’t have to keep checking the book.
The addition of a legacy’ish system does add a bit off replayability to the game that I like.
Considering vast catalogue of minis (including named heroes) and deep fluff CB developed up to date, I’d say that replayability is at any RPG level, some fans already work on new scenarios and settings.
Good points, and I like hearing that the community is working on additional content.
I read “upgrades” and see no cybermen… *sad*
This is a great and simple way to get involved in the game
This looks very like the progression mechanism in Brimstone. Not a complaint, it works well in that game.
they talk about cover a few times, i would love to be able to play this on my own terrain peaces. i wonder if they will have a way to go that?
Nice system to give flavor to the game
I do enjoy games with a progression system, it really adds an extra layer that scenarios just can’t provide. Using cards to enable the progression is an interesting idea.
Doesn’t look overly complicated or like it will bog down the game — especially since Defiance is co-op and as long as every player is competent, you should only have to focus on your cards and can learn the other characters’ capabilities as you play.
Progression tree is cool.
This game looks better and better the more I see of it.
Sounds good.
My interest couldn’t be any more piqued.
I like the co-op element of the game
What would be even more simple than learning what each symbol means, would be simply to say: If you roll a 1-3 on the black six sided dice, you block an additional hit. 1-3 is no hit, 4-5 is one hit and 6 is a critical hit. That is much easier than special dice symbols, because you already know a six sided die from all the other systems using a 6 sided die. You don’t have to sit there and mull over what the spiky symbol means, compared to the star. I’ve lately started to play Genesys Roleplaying system with their odd dice system and the multi colored dice.. and its still after 5 sessions a case of having to look up what the symbols exactly mean. Just give me some numbers, i don’t need to re-learn how the wheel works.
Assuming the dice mechanic is the same as Aristeia then it’s not as straightforward as your example suggests. You’re rolling for attack, defence and switches. You can fail in your attack but still activate another ability with switches. Sometimes you may launch an attack in the hope of getting a switch.
You can see an image of all the faces of all the dice in Aristeia here:
http://www.lead-rising.com/2017/08/aristeia-rules-summary.html
The system is pretty simple when you play and would be more difficult without symbols in my opinion.
I looked up a pic of those Genesys dice and they have a lot more going on!
If we assume they are the same dice… then you could say with exception of the black die, every 6 is a crit. Crit does X (whatever its color does).
Then you have say the yellow dice with a 2 up is a Pow (!), a roll of 4 is a Strike (Star) in addition, 5 is a double Pow (!!) and a strike (Star) and 6 is a Crit giving you one of each.
Red Dice you can do the same.. 2 up is a strike, 3-4 is a Pow in addition, 5 is a double strike and a pow and 6 is a crit with a super strike.
You can do this for most of these dice… Roll of 1 is always a fail. Roll of 6 is a special effect. 2-5 gives Effect 1, 3-5 gives extra effect 2 and 5 does either give additional effect 1 or 2.
And then you have to figure out when to roll which color of dice.. and whatnot… this could be so much easier. Make the Black Dice a D4. The Rest convert into a d6, d8 or d10… add the numbers.. done. The person rolling the highest number wins. To activate special effect, instead of needing 3 Pows you need to have rolled a 6 or 7. And everyone can use their pretty dice they collected over 20+ years… and those $50 metal dice made of pure gold you are so proud of can be used for this system (and no i don’t have such a die, but i know people really love their super expensive metal dice).
You simply cannot convince me that using symbols on the dice is a much easier way to do things than simply using different dice with numbers and/or just adding the numbers and having special effects go off based on the total number you rolled. And you could simply go “you are in cover, your defense goes up one dice size” To say you are using a D8 now instead of a D6 is hardly different from having a rule that says “and now add the green yellow dice to your Red because you did x”
Orange, blue and yellow dice have faces containing both attack and defence. This allows both characters to do damage to each other on the same roll. You may find that one character does 3 damage to their opponent, while the other does 1 damage back. It’s not a case of whoever rolls highest wins. In your system you’d need to do two separate rolls for this.
The blue dice has one face with a hit, a block and a switch. It has another face with two blocks and a switch. Two blocks aren’t a crit, they’re just two blocks. Which is best? Both have their merits. To call one a 6 and one a 5, then use those totals to figure out success assumes one is better than the other.
The green dice allows a crit block. One effect of this allows you to remove one of your opponents dice. This can be a tricky choice because you may wish to stop them activating a switch rather than them getting a hit. You might leave a dice doing more damage to remove a dice giving more switches. In your system I only need to remove the highest dice.
Orange and blue dice appear to be equivalent in that you can swap hits for blocks. However the blue dice has one extra switch over the orange dice. The green dice gives you a chance of a crit block but fails to do anything on a 1 and a 2; not just a 1 like most other dice. These are subtle differences that won’t be reflected by switching up to a different sided dice. You could use lookup tables but then you are adding an extra step to gameplay.
The best chance of triggering a switch is to use yellow dice. These dice are not so good for rolling attacks and blocks. To try and aggregate all your rolls into one total where rolling a 6-7 or higher triggers a switch misses the point. In your system you’ll very likely achieve a switch if you manage to hit. That’s not the case in Aristeia. You can do big damage without triggering any switches.
Totalling individual numbers implies the bigger the roll the better. Aristeia dice don’t work like that. Rolling a crit for an attack is great but does nothing to help you get a switch. That’s by design. You’re rolling for three, separate totals and the balance of dice you have won’t favour all of them.
Imperial Assault has similar systems. You roll six sided dice to attack but each face will have up to 2 of 3 symbols displayed on it
– a number
– hit icons
– “surge” icons (similar to switches)
Using a combination of the 3 you work out your range, number of hits and how many specials you can trigger. It’s a great mechanic with higher numbers increasing the distance you can shoot having lower numbers of hits. There’s no way to replicate that with a standard 6 sided dice without some kind of lookup table.
Custom dice can definitely bring some interesting things to the table
I really like this upgrade system. Especially since it’s not a fixed advancement
This looks like a really straight forward mechanic.
Hope they offer a play mat that shows the inside of the ship and the various locations versus just the picture of the ship and spots to be on. Would be more immersive if you had a ship interior.
I want a miniature of the ship lol
Like the upgrades system, allows you to put your own stamp on the character
Looks like you could almost turn this into an RPG work a little creative effort (and yes, I do realize that there is one by Modiphius).
Adds to the replay ability plain and simple. Great stuff!
so you can ultra specialise your specialist’s.
I love the branching upgrades, gives it a lot of replayability getting to try out different play styles with each of different characters.
Warzan is 100% correct when he says that levelling up your character is the key to Dungeon Diving, it allows you to be what ever you choose ( Good, Eval, Strong or Cunning ) its why we as gamers play. It allows us to be that person we all have inside but some of us never show.
Easy way to upgrade and store characters between sessions.
looks great. Hope they build in a way for DMs to build their own stories and add features
This is why I am going to pledge. So many games have great mechanics for combat, but few have an advancement system that makes you invest in your character. I can’t wait to play this with my family!
Lots of comparison to other games. Is this rule set not original?
I believe it’s a reworking of the Aristeia! rules
Are equipment items in any way tied to the progression system? Are any items limited by certain skill tress for example?
That’s an excellent question – I would hope so for the more exotic weapon choices.
Sort of like Imperial Assault?
Sold! Just backed it.
Being able to customize your character is always a good thing for fun game play.
Cant’ wait to test this game!!
Character progression through campaigns is a crucial feature of such a game. I presume the range available on the ship means the same players aren’t essential through a series of games?
I like that it’s based on Aristeia that will make the next two games I pick up very easy to learn.
I’m not seeing huge replayability but them I’m not really a replay kind of guy. One good campaign is fine by me. With a couple of expansions unlocked this will be plenty of content I reckon. The key will be whether this sucks people into full Infinity I.e. is it going to make breaking into the full ruleset materially easier? Hoping there’s a video on that at some point.
It’s as replayable as any scenario based Dungeon Crawler I guess. You can play through the missions more than once using different characters or using the same ones and levelling them up in a different way. But once you play a mission once you obviously have the whole spoilers thing to contend with
very cool, can we hope for a guide to build our own characters?
The progression system looks simple, elegant and straightforward. I think this will be one of the major positive points for the game.
Infinity with an rpg progression element beyond the spec-ops. Awesome
I wish I could afford it. It looks fantastic for the minis alone. The game itself looks good too.
Light RPG elements are my favorite.
I think this will be a great thing. And would not be surprised if this could turn into a series of spin off scenarios
I’ve seen how dense the Infinity rules were, more so with the number of factional choices, so making intuitive cards and a simpler engine are really great steps to making the game approachable and easy-for-entry. Defiance, here I come!
Streamlined play AND Infinity models?!?! This will get me and the crew to play.
Upgrading during the campaign is an great feature.
The experience trees and card mechanics look interesting and can vary the play style to give a lot of replayabliity
rpg elements? sounds interesting.
Really like the upgrading aspect and look forward to seeing all the shiny options.
Like the progression ideas.. Playability ahoy!
Cards for equipment and abilities are definitely the way to go for me. Sure, if you play a LOT you would probably be familiar with special rules represented by icons or key words, but always checking the rulebook if you aren’t is no fun.
Always a good thing to have option when leveling up your characters
hmm im toying around with the idea of making my own dashboards for this, i wonder how the upgrades will affect that.
Love this – cards make it so much easier!
Seems pretty straight forward for campaign gaming. Please please please CB support this going forward it has such awesome potential
The progression does seem to make this game. i imagine the gameplay would get samey and repetative after a while without it.
Simple yet effective way to customize your characters.
Is it possible to win more than one competition with you guys?
I like the “tech tree” thing. Very excited to get this game on the table.
Really impressed with the development tree idea. It helps maintain the feel of each character. Great concept.
Each vid is making it more likely for me to back this.
God, I can’t wait to expand the infinity universe and bring a dungeoncrawler ton my friend
Customisation is always fun. I am looking forward to finding weird combos for the characters.
I need to win this!
I love the progression idea as that makes every game individual.
i like the upgrade mechanics, seems easy to follow
Can’t wait to have it!
Yeah Card progression is definately the way to go! 😀 awesome!
Choices DO matter.
This upgrade system looks so sweet!
wee app to keep track of this between session would be nice.
Nice
Really looks good. I do like the Aristeia dice system, and this seems like a great way to play in the Infinity Sphere.
Carlos enthusiasm is infectious
I love options like this in video games. I’m still enamored with X-Com: Enemy Within’s overall system, for instance.
I think this will work really well.
We’ll have to keep track between sessions, of course.
Anyone know if you’ll be able to make your own heroes?
Comments + Giveaway + Dungeon Crawler and miniatures…..wow I am all for it!