So the recent 9th age Kickstarter campaign failed to fund. Any thoughts on why?

[maledrakhParticipant 11996xp 0]

So the recent 9th age Kickstarter campaign failed to fund. This should more or less have been an automatic win, with only about 100 backers needed.

Any thoughts on why this failed apart from the time of year?

[somegeezer 18431xp 1]

Time of year’s undoubtedly a factor. I’m also guessing a lot of 9th Age fans have large armies from the WFB 8th ed days, and just the sheer expense of an all-metal mass battle army.

They’re quite niche for a Kickstarter in an age dominated by “everything to play in one box” miniatures game/boardgame crossovers.

They’re utterly glorious miniatures though and I hope they flourish through more traditional means.

[zeker1966 1633xp 1]

I don’t think time of year had anything to do with it. I think it is very indicative of the gaming community moving on. True only 100 backers were needed and it still didn’t fund. This indicates one of three things; the advertising didn’t reach the people it needed to, people that play don’t need the figures, or, there really aren’t that many interested in investing in the 9th age.

[onlyonepinman 18062xp 3]

Honestly, I think they weren’t selling something people wanted.  All of the armies in 9th age can be easily constructed for less money from other ranges.  They neither offered something new nor something cheap – in other words it didn’t really have a Unique Selling Point.  The miniatures were quite nice but ultimately quite expensive.  You could go to Fireforge and get the bulk of a much larger army for Kingdom of Equitaine for the same price, the only thing they’re lacking a little in is characters.

[caledor2 4273xp 1]

I think the time of year might not have so big an impact with this project. The prices aren’t that big compared to other KS.

I agree with somegeezer and zeker1966 that the players (especially the veterans) already have huge armies to play and will only be interested in the rules and those are free.

Maybe they didn’t focus that much on new players, no 2-player set for example.

They don’t offer much variety towards people who want to start a new army. You only have a small force and nothing to expand on it.

And for me personally, the models look old school which might detract new players who have seen models from other ranges.

 

 

And for me personnaly, the models look old school which might detract new players who have seen models from other ranges.

 

[limburger 21708xp 2]

I hope the irony of trying to promote a ‘quick start’ rules set without a basic 2 player starter pack wasn’t lost on the creators …

And then there’s the text of the campaign itself :

“The 9th Age is for experienced and veteran players, who enjoy a challenge and want to play in the largest and most competitive system in the world. ”

(that’s nice … but that’s not what your kickstarter is selling)

“Quick Starter (T9A:QS)is designed for faster games, with less experienced players in mind.”

This is what the campaign was supposed to sell … and it only is mentioned after scaring away any beginner.
Did I mention the lack of a ‘two player starter set’ type of pledge level ?
It is practically a requirement for multiplayer wargames. GW owns that space by a large margin when you look at the starter sets they offer these days as they cover everything from rulebook up to two nearly complete armies for their major systems. You’d be a fool not to try and copy their approach (IMHO)

The complete army sets will only attract experienced players (who by definition already own at least 1 army) except that wasn’t what the system was supposed to target.

Lack of a background is another issue for beginners. Why are these armies fighting ? What is at stake ? Where is the story ?
That may not matter at a tournament/competitive level, but it helps sell the armies themselves.

And as an added penalty … the system lacks an official owner.
As a new player it is important to have a single reference point for any official content.

I hope the people behind this campaign rally and try a relaunch that fixes the majority of the issues, but so far they have failed to prove that there is genuine interest in mass battle systems in the fantasy genre.

— edit —

This was there second attempt after already :

You’d think they would have learned how to sell their contribution to the 9th age setting by now …

[torros 23816xp 0]

I remember at the time when I looked that the figures were quite ex pensive. Personally while I do still like mass battle games 28mm is the last scale I would choose to use

[hephestoParticipant 880xp 0]

Tough call really, there’s so much that could potentially go wrong. The minis definitely aren’t on of them, very nice, metal stuff, which is bound to go over well with the old WHFB crowd.

That said I initially hadn’t even noticed this was a 9th age thing when it came by on various pages / groups, figured it was another ‘army’ Kickstarter. There are definitely some questions that come to mind:

– Who is this Kickstarter actually aimed at? There’s things in there that both could draw newcomers and veterans, but neither group actually get addressed in detail.

 

– What even is 9th Age, the page isn’t particularly insightful for the newcomer to the hobby. Both when it comes to the type of game or the setting there really isn’t much to grab that initial attention other than shiny models and some downloadable rules PDFs.

 

– Is there actually an audience for this? As in for 9th age in particular as I am sure those minis will find a home eventually. Are there enough folks out there though willing to invest some cash into what is essentially ‘just’ a fan project that may or may not be supported in the future.

 

– It could be that GW was right and that the WHFB consumer base was dried up. Personally I rather doubt this given how there’s a slew of quite active Middle / Oldhammer communities out there that still keep pumping out armies made of both ancient and brand new models. At the same time Kings of War, though being quite a different game to WHFB, has drawn in a lot of WHFB veterans. Fan projects outside of the small skirmish games don’t tend to have a long shelf life unfortunately. People move on, find it to much work to keep following along or in the case of WHFB may simply have given up with a nasty taste in the mouth after the world literally got blown up.

 

– Does there even need to be a 9th Age? Something I regularly see in say the Middlehammer community is that folks group together playing specific, older editions, often with a fairly limited errata. People don’t seem to actually need new rules or and at times even new armies. Veterans are drowning in models or already have a ton of other companies where they can pick up stuff. Feels like a very niche group in an already niche hobby.

 

– Lack of advertisement, really haven’t seen much on this outside the usual pages. Saw a bunch of folks in the Middlehammer group being surprised this was a thing, having completely missed it.

 

– Think the season may indeed have an influence, many of the larger (boardgame) miniature Kickstarter do tend to avoid the December / Januari period. Too much stuff going on in general, while the traditional companies (GW in particular) do tend to suck folks back for a few weeks / boxes / blisters.

[limburger 21708xp 1]

I doubt it is the season.

Yes, there are a ton of (expensive) (board)game kickstarters.

However not every gamer likes every type of game.

I’d rather argue that kickstarters aren’t the best method of attracting new consumers into a hobby, because they are risky (things can still fail!) and that’s not the kind of thing beginners do. A basic two-player starter set of the shelf in a local store is more than enough risk for most.

[chaingunParticipant 1939xp 1]

I used to really like playing the old WHFB until 8th edition came out, I really liked the background of the old WHFB. I was quite upset like many others when GW took the direction they did with Age of Sigmar, but I could see why they did at the time.

Why did this kickstarter fail?  I think the marketing behind the kickstarter was not what I would have expected. When I read through it I was confused as to whom it was directed at, a novice or veteran gamer. Or was it directed at someone who had played the beta versions of the game and already had miniatures, I don’t really know.

I don’t think the time of year was a major factor as let’s be honest as gamers we either like something or we don’t.

I think a contributory factor could have been a sign of the times, mass battle games like the old WHFB and 9th age are not in vogue these days as new projects. I know CMON done Ice and Fire, but that is played like a miniatures board game and not like the old style mass battle games. Kickstarters seem to fall in to two categories mainly, either a board game or a skirmish game and variations on these.

 

[redbenParticipant 9415xp 0]

Even with ASoI&F, if you’d been told that on the back of raising $4 million on Rising Sun and $5 million on Green Horde that CMON’s next big KS would be a Game of Thrones license, you’d probably expect it to make a lot of money. That it didn’t even reach $2 million is largely down to it being a rank & file battle game.

[torros 23816xp 0]

Did Cmon come out and say that?

[redbenParticipant 9415xp 0]

Say what?

[torros 23816xp 0]

That it didn’t even reach $2 million is largely down to it being a rank & file battle game.

Or imply it as to the reason the game didn’t do that well in people’s eyes, though 2 Millon seems pretty good to me

 

[redbenParticipant 9415xp 0]

To the best of my knowledge CMON don’t publicly comment on the success or otherwise of their KS campaigns.

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