Weekender: Are Space Marines Dead?
December 1, 2018 by dracs
We're getting stuck into a big discussion today around the future of Warhammer 40,000 and what the new campaign book and more could provide for players.
Weekender Podcast Download
As well as that we have TooFatLardies in the studio talking about one of their new games, Blitzkrieg 1940.
Updates
We're going to be kicking off with an announcement concerning the Space Hulk Tactics Hobby Challenge. We are going to be announcing the winners Tuesday 4th December at 17:00 GMT.
As well as that we've had John painting up the epic VrilPanzer from Reichbusters: Projekt Vril this week and you can catch up on his work HERE.
Are OG Space Marines Dead?
Before you get your tongue in a twist, we're not saying that all Space Marines are dying. What we are saying is that it's probably about time that Games Workshop started to properly phase out the old designs for the Space Marines in favour of the Primaris style.
We saw this in the new miniature for Marneus Calgar last weekend which came on the back of some great news about the new campaign book and more for the world of Vigilus.
A lot of people love those old models but maybe it's about time to accept that they are pretty old now and need to be replaced with something in keeping with what a modern 'Space Marine' could look like.
Let us know your thoughts!
Blitzkrieg 1940 With TooFatLardies
We've also got TooFatLardies and Rich in the studio to talk about what's new from them concerning Blitzkrieg 1940 which seems like it is going to be throwing a whole bunch of different factions into the mix for your World War II games.
Kickitaurs, Canitaurs & Felitaurs
Yeah, we've cracked open some of the new miniatures from Punga which are currently up on Kickstarter right now.
These are very cute indeed and I think it would be awesome to have us paired up against some of these lovable dogs and cats to see which we'd be.
Competitions - WIN 3x Rampart Pledges With BoW Shield Logos
We're also back with Archon again this week giving away another THREE Rampart Terrain pledges from their recent Kickstarter.
You will also get some exclusive BoW Shield Logos which you can use to magnetise and stick onto the walls so you can fight through your very own OTT Towers.
Also, the winner for the latest Carnevale Two-Player Starter Set is announced and you can Claim Your Prize and check out past winners there too.
Have a great weekend!
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BOOM!! Happy Weekend!!
It was the same story when the original marines from the RTB01 box got replaced by the first static pose metal marines. It will only hurt forever during the eternal period when everything is completely ruined. Then your grognard “Back in my Day” license will arrive in the mail, authorizing you to tell stories about ‘real’ space marine minis to ‘kids with no respect.’ 😛
Happy Weekend!
I think Space Marines are far from over. I don’t plan to replace my Imperial Fist Army with Primaris. (too expensive and too much history that I have with my army) But there may be changes to come.
It’s always good to see TooFatLardies in the Studio. Love their games. ‘What a Tanker’ is awesome!
@templar007 – Good God, man. Are you kidding me? You know what I’m talking about.
I can’t even begin to express my gratitude. 😀 😀 😀
3rd!
Happy weekend guys!
I’ll watch the 1st half of the show before bedtime and the rest after waking up!
Come on guys, laughing so loud at about 09:50! I’ll have to stop sooner before waking up the neighbors!
42 minutes in, sleep time, i’ll finish you guys errr, i mean i’ll finish the vid later today (late afternoon for you guys)!
They just need a suitable back story in the lore and they can ‘primaris’ everything.
It’s the Weekend!
1. Space Marines have been dead to me for a few years now.
3. Those Thingitaurs are just… Weird!
Had they said from the outset “This is the new Space Marine (just the latest of many armour patterns)” to add to your old models or replace if you want (for aesthetic reasons) then that would have been fine with me.
As soon as they said “This is the new enhanced Space Marine” add or replace, but really these are better on the table then it became a cynical business model.
With the first option they could still have driven sales by allowing new squad configurations only available out of the box using the new models. I bet however they still had gazillions of boxes containing old pattern SMs that would immediately have become effectively obsolete, dead stock.
Tricky one for GW, not that it mattered to me as I’d given up on 40k by then anyway; except it’s made selling my old army very difficult.
I like Primaris but, I don’t think they would stop making normal marines after all Calgar almost died during the upgrade.
I am pretty sure that in the end the Primaris will phase out the old marines though I don’t think it will be for a while, they will just stop making new stuff in the old marine style and like models in the past be just left behind.
Well the packers finished packing out the entire house yesterday after three days of chaos the hardest part of the move on this end is done. Now time for a weekender! Great seeing you guys last week, shop looks great and the tables were awesome!
Great show guys! Not sure about doggie style D&D but if they have a killer attackbYorkie I might be up for it. But if Warren fly’s to GENCON I’ll definitely go see it for my first visit to GENCON.
Forgot to mention I do agree with Justin on space marine tactical squad always having a place.
And the Rampart Gothic terrain is epic!
Have a safe flight home.
The (small) space marine is dead, long live the (small) space marine.
Happy Weekend
It’s clear that they are going to write out the ‘old marines’ now good old M.C has taken his trip into whatever magic machine Cawl has developed so they get to keep all the old special characters (well the ones they want to anyway) while re-doing the models to the new size
I’d rather they’d taken the route they did with the RTB01 original plastic marines and just made the new stuff bigger without any ‘fluff’ reason since it’s something that’s been going on since the srart of the hobby (even recently with the deathwatch overkill marines)
but the old marines can be upgraded to new bigger marines seems overly cheesy
**SPOILERS**
Capt Boppo wished really hard to be big at a Zoltar Speaks machine.
Welcome to the weekend,and only 18 days until I have 2weeks off and hobbying for those glorious two weeks. The plan is to clear all the part painted minis on my table, so that I start 2019 fresh with no unfinished projects .
Dungeon Busters sound good, and so does Robin Hood.
I think Space Marines are dead as they are. Primaris will be become the standard for Marines. I personally became bored of Marines back in 2011, when I sold both my Dark Angels and Blood Angels. I’ve not painted a marine until this year when I picked some Primaris Marines. I now will only paint Primaris, the old marines are naff in comparison.
I wish the other factions would get some much needed upgrades first (especially the Eldar and their aspect warriors).
Primaris replacing ‘classic’ spacemarines is simply how the battlefield works. You don’t keep the old stuff once the better gear arrives. So why would the genetically enhanced monsters be any different ?
The only problem is that so far they haven’t done anything remotely similar to the rest of the hardware the space marine chapters have by claiming no one understands how to make new stuff. And now they dare to modify the human template to such a degree a new and ‘better’ superhuman is born ?
Happy saturday folks!
So I’m guessing it was my comments that kicked off this Space Marine discussion…..
Nothing has changed, for me the future is clearly Primaris and that is the end of 40k for me. I’ve spent ~£3500, building a 13500pts army over the past 6yrs, (Edit: my most recent 40k army – have been a marine player for over 25yrs) and until the release of Primaris I was happily continuing to expand (almost finished a 2nd company), if GW think I’m going to replace that with Primaris they are very much mistaken.
There is another side issue from this – Horus Heresy. Forge World release new kits for 30k, which also get rules to allow their use in 40k, and more recently the main line infantry kits (MK3/4, Tartaros, Cataphractii) have now been moved to plastic as well and their original resin counterparts withdrawn. Now if you go re-scaling the 40k line, these kits are going to look small, making them less viable for GW/FW to produce. So does that mean they also need to completely re-scale 30k as well now? Again, a decision that will cause major ructions in the HH community….
With regards to the Vigilus campaign and creating a localised setting with a reason for your armies to be fighting, this is nothing new, Forge World’s Imperial Armour campaign books have been doing this for well over a decade.
Maybe its time I went “full grognard” and moved entirely into historicals…. 😀
(But then HH is technically “historical” 40k as well…)
*historical chanting* join us, join us
I’m already there Gerry 😀
I’ve played Bolt Action for many years and looking at giving FoW another go after a failed attempt a while back
Latest edition of FoW is much smoother
Love the rampart stuff… gorgeous work!
As for the marines, I love the look of the new Primaris (apparently not new anymore… where has the time gone?). Don’t see the issue with phasing out the older style, that’s the way of things… and everyone can still use their old forces, especially if they just become normal marines (I.E everyone becomes Primaris across the board) in a handful of years…. then they just become an old style army with the same play style / rules.
As some one who has collected Space Marines for over 11 years and have armies for both Blood Angels and Dark Angels I feel that phasing out regular Marines for Primaris Marines is going to be what is going to be what will eventually drive me away from GW products if I would have to replace all my miniatures that I have used my time and money to with new ones just because GW wants to gator to new customers over those of us that have been buying they products for decade or more. Knowing GW they won’t keep rules for those regular SM units after they get rid of entire range so that means we veterans are stuck with lot of miniatures that we can’t use anymore.
Forwarding the 40k universe- All of the Space Marines are ordered to have Primaris upgrade. Many refuse this as messing with their holy gene-seed. Primaris Marines used to enforce changes. Many Marines breakaway to form independent enclaves but still loyal to Emperor. Another massive civil war breaks out. Finally it resolves that there is flaw in Primaris process and old Marines ride in to save the day.
Amazing plot twist right there!!!
Want to see this happen lol
I bet some chapters are still waiting or their Mk viii Errant armour never mind new primaris Marines @warzan
I agree with Warren on the ‘scale’ redo, with as mentioned Orks being the main targets (they need it). I don’t play 40K, but the new Chaos Marines from Blackstone could get me back into the fold, especially if ‘biggified’.
I do think Justin had some valid points, but just not in relation to the discussion the rest of you were having at the time.
Of to pre-order the AT Battleforce box – that’s my 40K, so no Primaris for me.
Warren, I think even you could manage to paint up a Custodes force. Gold spray paint, gloss flesh wash, light silver drybrush, spot of gun metal. Lick o’paint, lick o’paint…givus a biscuit.
1 billion ( 1,000,000,000 ) Space Marines sold over 30 years is around 300,000 a day. I think that’s a stretch. But 1 million ( 1,000,000 ) Space Marines sold over 30 years is around 300 a day. So i would guess there are tens, possibly hundreds of millions of Space Marines out there.
Ah – but how many are still sitting in GWs depots as unsold stock?
Hm… Given that they make them themselves i would think not that many. Thousands would be my guess.
Thanks for the show. I have no difficulty upscaling SM to make them tougher in the game. But if the other factions follow suit then they will just revert to the current sorry state of being the tax you pay to bring on an army built on elites necessary to successfully cope with your opponents.
happy weekend.
great show.
i got to say that terrain set looks awesome. have many plans for many of my games.
GW could do some rework on some of the factions like the orcs but there is some that should just let it as it is.
I wouldn’t say no to some of that terrain. Regarding space marines, I’m not so invested but I trust modern GW to do the right thing.
Shield logos for the Rampert Terrain. Classic
Great prize again. Rampart have a great product and their Kazumi Temple stuff would look amamzing on my jungle table.
I can’t believe @dracs missed the chance to pitch Moria Busters. Sneaking around quietly until some fool of a Took makes a big enough noise to awaken the drums in the deep. Classic.
I thought exactly the same thing about Moria!
Great show! And it is time to retire the old models. I feel they need to slowly update most of there older lines.
Ancienty Sharpe Practice you say? You may take my money,sir!
i’ve got to say i like the primaris marines models. they are fantastic, they increase in size is good, it makes them feel and look like a space marine that towers over standard humans. normal space marines in 40k i don’t care about really, i’ve stopped playing 8th ED mostly, i find the game a bit too boring but i am massively into Horus heresy. I enjoy the rules more and the model range, i prefer the 30K MKs of armour over the 40k marines and the primaris marines, as long as they keep producing plastic MKIII marines i will be happy.
i agree with warren that Orks really do need a scale increase and modernising to fit anywhere in the 40k universe. the new ork release is a good start but more definitely needs to be done. A lot of the other factions don’t really need any work doing to them to keep them relevant. I do see where justin is coming from in a sense. but ogryns aren’t anyway comparable to the total redesign of the space marines. i would argue that an the imperial guard as a whole does need a massive overhaul, but in scale though because a guardsman should in no way be close to being as tall as a marine. the plastic cadian models are old and don’t really do GW any justice. from a model prospective they are outdated and from fluff side the cadians are now long dead since the fall of cadia, i know that their combat gear was very common issue in the guard but it’s be about 150 years since the fall of cadia, so lets have a new plastic range for them, give one of the old metal regiments a turn in the spot light. maybe the steel legion as armourgeddon has a big part to play in the current lore. or simply have a generic set of legs with different torso’s that way you could make steel legion, mordians, pretorians, ect.
just by looking at the quality of sculpts in the new boxed games coming from GW shows they can do amazing things. it’s time to Make The Guard Great Again!
I’m sure Cadia going pop was more to do with a model refresh than any need for the plot line.
Happy weekend Guy’s the good thing about the custodian force is that they are a 40K army with 30k sized force’s if you can game that big.
Happy weekend all!
Excited to see Warren dive in to a new 40k project! 🙂 A little surprised its not Deathwing related!
For me the Primaris marines are size wise what the old marines should have been. The scale means a lot to me, they should be massive, bigger than a guardsman, bigger than an Eldar! I own a lot of the old style marines, but think I’m ready for the change over! Perhaps in the next edition it will be a complete change over, and 8th is just breaking us in so to speak…
Oh and I wish i didnt have the Calgar and honour guard unopened in box here… now hes outdated! Although the current model is great looking I think.. apart from finecast …
If they are next gening the Marines are new Titan’s,ship’s,alien’s, getting some attention soon Guy’s???
If you want to read some interesting stories about WW2 try Shadow Knights, published by Simon and Schuster…
This is the blurb about the book…
“Hell-bent on conquering Europe, Hitler had just set his sights on England when Winston Churchill reached into his bag of tricks and invented a secret spy network of ordinary citizens. These schoolteachers, housewives, prostitutes, and farmers abandoned their former lives, trained in covert black ops, and set Europe ablaze. Parachuting into Nazi territory under the cover of night, they destroyed factories, armed resistance networks, and turned Hitler’s juggernaut on its head.”
I’d like to offer my two cents on the ‘death of the Imperium’. I believe that GW, as a business, is managing its 40k backstory in such a way as to allow GW flexibilty to respond to market changes. That is, if their Primaris experiment had been a financial flop, then GW may have moved closer to radically changing the 40k game. Also, unlike Fantasy, which was losing players, 40k is GW’s cash cow. They are more apt to be responsive to community/market ‘demands’ over 40k than they were with the dying Fantasy.
I think Justin was right in challenging Warren on the 2 minutes to midnight. There is too much invested in keeping the 40k player base happy to do something too drastic, universe-wise, that GW hemorrhages customers. Thus, the backstory can be conveniently altered in any manner GW wishes to maximize community interest.
Hope that made sense.
Also, my wish is to see every model be only 2-4 pieces that assemble like the Blackstone fortress models. No more old models whare every gun and arm is seperate!
I thing Games workshop intends the Primaris to be the defacto “space marine” in future iteration of 40K.
Ohh i like the idea of Dungeon-buster, right now ideas for expansion for Reichbusters are an underwater base and the moon are being discuss.
Are Space Marines – dead?…..
The words of an old song from those great philosophers of musc – ABBA – spring to mind..
Money Money Money, must be funny, in the rich man’s world!!!
Of course they’re dead – how’s GW going to make more money… And then there will be the Space Marines revenge Figures, and the …. etc etc
Not really into 40K or WW2 stuff, so I’m just commenting in hopes of winning some of that cool Rampart terrain. At least I’m honest!
I winder if we’ll see old pattern Space Marines relegated to Heresy Era and Primaris strictly “modern era”?
Well Justin was in argumentative mood today, I swear if someone had said the sky is UP, he would have disagreed 😀
Managed to finish the show as i was eating breakfast!
I agree with @warzan on the whole Primaris point (or did we miss it… 😉 ). To me, when i saw the Primaris, i immediately thought that was going to be case… at some point. The simple way would’ve been to replace the entire space marine range but, they would’ve gotten a lot of flak over this…
The only thing i don’t like with the Primaris, is the new tech, people revere simple lasgun/vehicules and pray that they work, etc. The 40K lore seems to indicate that it’s hard to produce stuff and the Primaris arrive with shinny new tech: flying tanks (sorry don’t know the name), fancy guns and all, instead of a bigger rhino or landraider.
That was my 2 cents, see you on XLBS!
P.S.: no doggy-style D&D for me @warzan !
I remember when they got shot of grav vehicles for the imperials barring landspeeders, even the bikes went and it was a big deal that the ravenwing had a speeder bike for their chapter master…then the primarse mareens arrived and… is that a f’ing grav landraider…
indeed
being new to 40k piece not sure as im getting my 2 armies by the mag so dont get one massive hit, so im so new I dont know!!
No better way to start my Saturday then painting some minis and listening to the weekender.
I also think Primaris is the natural evolution of the SM line.
I love the Primaris designs for the Reivers. The others are okay. My big issue is that my favorite faction is forever prevented from getting the upgrade due to the lore, and I’m wondering if they’ll finally write them out. Legion of the Damned. There is just no real way to explain how they’d have pulled off the upgrade. That’s how it goes I suppose. They’ve been dying literally and figuratively for decades anyway, I suppose. All good things…
I do like the idea of making the old versions valuable by giving them some kind of special rule, but that flies in the face of GW’s point for the change. (Update the look so people will buy more space marines.) So I have my doubts.
Given that I see no reason to upgrade scale on anything else. Look maybe, yes, but not scale. Why? Isn’t that the point? The Primaris are supposed to be the biggest and baddest on the block now yes? Why would the other factions suddenly have a similar jump in scale? It makes no sense, unless they have a narrative driven answer to it. I agree it makes the Orcs look less tough, but lacking a narrative cause, which is the precedent now set, there would be no reason to up scale them.
Happy weekend! Rampart prize, Awesome! Another great show!
Oh those puns were purrrfect and the cats meow. Groans are accepted. Justin did have a point, it was just too bad it was on his head.
Yes, there is a point where you make enough ‘tweaks’ that they accumulate to be equivalent to an entire re-design.
But when the orks [FINALLY] get some sort of treatment to bring them into a better scale relative to the Primaris, the NuOrks will definitely make the current orks look like runty, weedy grots.
So GW could make use of the old orks by rebranding them with a bit of fluff saying that the gretchin finally have gotten hold of good weapons and organized into better armed units. With a quick Gretchin sticker slapped over the word “Boyz” on every box, everyone suddenly has a perfectly usable Rebel Grot Army and they can build a whole new Ork army without wasting any minis. 😀 😀 😀
What an episode! I am on the side that having TWO types of Space Marine is very silly, badly thought out and takes away from 40k in a dire way. New players to the game will become even more confused as they start to realize they’re two sizes of Space Marine… in addition to a thousand chapters, 14 armies, 3 other types of game in the 40k universe, spaceships… boardgames and the ability for the model you just bought to be considered ‘small’ and replaced with a $41 CAD Primaris version the next week.
I see that @warzan has a different perspective on the whole Space Marine Primaris thing, a more open perspective I would say. Me on the other hand, I have 300 Space Marine models in my collection. So my perspective on being made ‘redundant’ is not as open as yours. Suffice to say, I bit the bullet and bought some Primaris, then proceeded to turn them into Mk6 ‘beaky’ Space Marines! Removing all the extra TAU designs, the thigh plates, ankles bobbles and huge gorget.
If life gives YOUR hobby lemons, make lemonade! At the very least, you can find some Primaris on Ebay and then put them in a blender, makes good rubble! 😛
Everyone’s hands are too big.
I think the space marines are being phased out and replaced by Primaris. All signs point to that. And that is fine. Don’t get me wrong – I love the space marines designs. All the way back from the studded shoulder pads up until today (okay maybe up until those silly centurions but you know what I mean).
And that is ok.
Because the new generation don’t have that attachment to them the way that is old farts have. To them the Primaris are simply cooler. Without emotional attachment why would you want to buy space marines if you can buy Primaris (and the rules support it)? As a company GW will also have to continue to renew their product portfolio.
I will miss the space marines. For sure. But the world moves on and the new generations will want their own thing.
turkey trots to water GG I agree with justin. the only thing the imperial guard need is a revamp, no chanel in scale but I think the old plastic imperial guard was the best, simple, cheap and functional when compared to the space marines. if the primarus get added to the space Marines, no problem. if thereplace them as new space Marine standard, then maybe the imperial guard should get a redesign. orcs…..hmmmmm, do they need a redesign or just a scale up…,again ,if primarus is an augmentation, no but a repalcement, then yes to keep the scale proper.
RR the world wonders
Been some years since I played 40k but am still drawn to the old style marines. I think both could still exist as time isn’t advancing that quickly and new and old would feasibly overlap. I’d play old marines as part of a chapter returning from a decades-long mission and seeing this new breed of marine for the first time.
I’ve also been watching the Rampart terrain. So tempted, but have sworn off new KS’s until I catch up on ones I’ve been in. Looks like a great system, though.
Justin is right Warren, you were over focusing on scale! The important part of the Primaris redesign was not that they were made bigger, although it does help to make them larger than regular humans because they were always meant to be giants.
The reason I was impressed by the Primaris was because they fixed the proportions of marines. They have longer limbs to go with those pauldrons and it makes them look much more plausible.
The Eldar Avatar however needs scaling up and modernising.
Great to see more from TooFatLardies! I think their rules are truly unique in a lot of ways. Space Marines are too iconic to die out.
John has gone in to hiding :p
Wow an interesting discussion, I had to agree to @dignity that GW should look at updating other scuplts than just the Space Marines, I don’t think the Astra Militarium need to be made taller, but it wouldn’t hurt (with the death of Cadia – long live Cadia) for the basic trooper to be moved on with different armour.
Who doesn’t like a Building Set????
Now we know you have the right canitaur minis, I reiterate my call for you guys to do a canitaur D&D game. 😉
I just started collecting again after 30years and started a grey knight army,which dont have primaris armour,so i think the marines are here to stay but i did buy the Dark Imperium box set and even the death Gaurd are primaris size. So who knows and are the Imperial knight piolts still standard size as they are new to the table ? also at least we know 30k will be fine still with the old models :)
Probably already been mentioned but regarding thoughts of Inquisitors in Kill Team, the next rumoured expandion is to be Inquisitors.
The Chain of Command supplement that would get me buying the rules instantly is the campaigns in Tunisia. I have long been fascinated by this particular war (read “England’s Last War Against France” by Colin Smith”-excellent book) The forces involved include the usual Italians, Germans, British, and even these have interesting forces including cavalry, bedouins, Rolls Royce Armoured Cars. Added to this you also have the Free and Vichy French which include the Foriegn Legion, Goumiers, Senegalese, Spahis and various Cavalry, Australians, Sikh and many other Commonwealth Nations. It was also the first Allied operation with the Americans (as far as I am aware).
always need more terrain love to see what games would work well in the Aztec site ones.
Love the show !
Those Rampart looks great, specially with BoW shields. Would be awesome to have an BoW Fortress/city block 🙂
BoW shields for Rampart? Count me in!
Warzan if you like the Custode and you want to play kill team why not use the grey knight rules.
Pretty impressed with those Rampart sets, definitely see application over multiple game systems. And the stairs are a great addition!
Great interview with Richard. My chosen period for C of C was already 1940 France. I got the new book when it came out and it is great. I hooked up with some Lardies at the last HMGS show (Fall In). They are planning a Lardie day in the spring. The Lard is spreading here in the States.
Next period I would like to see from the Lardies is North Africa and maybe carry that into the Italian campaign.
I would suspect that the primaris marines will replace the original space marine. The transition will be slow due in part to wanting to sell stock of the old stuff and it takes time to sculpt up an entire army with all the options. And the vehicles would need updating as well. Remember there are several different space marine factions that need to be primarisized.
There are a couple of things that I wanted to point out about this show. The first is that Warren got it horribly wrong. The second is that GW is learning.
Space marines are not dead, yet. As things move forward in the 41st Millennium all marines and things marine will eventually get Primarisized (I know it wasn’t a real word, but it is now). The problem with marines was that with armour on they were the same size as a guardsman when they needed to be nearly twice that. It didn’t match the fluff nor did the miniature ‘feel’ like monsters on the battlefield. From GW’s point of view, that was fine as it meant an army of marines wasn’t that much smaller or cheaper than other armies
After the End of the Old World and the initial failure of AoS to catch on there was a massive change in GW thinking about their IP’s. Ultimately it was acknowledged that never again could the story end with “and then they all died”. It was a fiscal disaster for GW. Sure the 40K universe is still the ‘Grim, Dark’, and if anything the place is more battered than ever before, but there’s something new in the story, hope. Chaos has been stopped. A Primarch has returned and more will arrive soon. GW has learned. Death, despair and eternal war are fine, so long as there remains a story to tell and killing the universe doesn’t leave anything to sell.
in the 42nd millennium there is only peace and love 😉
I think we are still a ways from any full replacement for the Marines. I’m just going to enjoy the new stuff from the side. I enjoy Necromunda and have a fee Guard, so Space Marine changes dont impact me much.
How would you design a cathedral terrain to cover a 4×6 table? Could it be done in such a way as to avoid removing walls or a roof to access the insides? The removable roof or wall would spoil the illusion some what.
That is an awesome theme to a custodian army.
If the Space Marines die, does that mean I could pick up an army on the cheap?
The rampart designs look pretty sweet. Any word on if they plan to expand the ranges over time vs new themes?
Why would they phase something out when it both sells well and works fine in the game? Maybe points tweaks or something, but I’d be very surprised if the old marines get totally removed.
Good looking terrain. Even better if they included magnets!
The Rampart Gothic terrain looks amazing.
The Rampart stuff is looking amazing! The Kazumi temple would supplement mijn jungle table greatly for games of AvP, KoW and 40k! ^^
Also loved the interview with Richard, I’m going to have to take a look at CoC.
Are Space Marines Dead?: We aren’t that lucky.
The Rampart terrain looks great.
Happy Weekend everyone!
@warzan I share your opinions on space marine design. The venerable Tactical Squad idea is exactly what I have in mind for my Howling Griffons. I hope to make one, maybe two tactical squads for the army that are just veterans who have stuck around. At the same time several of my Primaris Marines are still wearing the old helmets. Even the Corvus models. The reason for that is, that either they lost the new helmets and were issued old spares as field replacements ore that they just didn’t want to give up their old ones after their bodies were upgraded. Some of them are wearing tabards too, which is a chapter tradition and something the terra-born, previous Ultramarines (the Holing Griffons are a pure Ultramarine succussor) are not taking up so easily.
And of course it is a business move by GW. But they have to keep moving. Also the old Space Marine sculpts were good, but they did have issues that had not aged well. Making this clean cut in design was really the only way and was somewhat overdue.
I don’t know if we can call old Space marines dead. I’m certain that they will be replaced with the Primaris but I don’t think we are there yet. Right now, in my mind at least, I still think that most of the chapters are mostly composed od regular marines. The Primaris are just the icing on the cake.
It’s amazing How you guys can be talking, yet be sooooooo on different pages. I love it. Any time you guys can have two fat lardies on the show is worth it. The dog and cat minis are cool but the rampart stuff is awesome !!
And a comment to (try to) win the terrain 😉
I was expecting a theory about how all the space marines are technically undead. They’ll either phase the old or new ones out, or maybe have some kind of new civil war occur between them, maybe creatibf a whole new faction, or making all the remaining classic marines belong to Chaos as another visual means of denoting the difference between good and bad marines.
Reich busturs could be reskinned to figh ghosts
I want Sharp Practice Ancients!!!! And that is the truth!
Maybe it is time for the old style marines to be put to bed, and slowly phase in the Primaris which has already started. It will be a shame to see the old marines fade, but they
ll never be forgotten. I have four different marine armies..............Ultras.....Wolves....Legion of the Damned and the Sons Of Cydonia (a chapter of my own design), These only get used as and when me and my friends have a gaming weekend. I do have some Primaris marines, which will be getting added to the Sons as im not looking at doing a chapter of then this late in my life. My Ultras have minis from the Rouge Trader Era through to the present not including Primaris, at nearly a hundred troops with vehicles i did not see the need to expand on them.If Reich Busters had not been running at the same time as Rampart i would of backed it, Rampart looks really amazing and by the looks of things there
s no limit to what you can do or how big a ruin you can make. If it goes to retail then ill look at getting a few, if not then damn you Reich Busters for such lovely minis.Hey hey there, just signed on up, nice place ya got here! Talking about the “death” of the wee marines, I definitely think that space marines need some new models (some models more than others), but I’d still like if the older ones could be kept around too. At the shop I frequent, there’s a guy who’s been working to assemble and paint an entire chapter of space marines (yes,1,000 space marines), and if primaris scale did end up overtaking the smaller-marines, it’d really devastate him, and everyone like him who put a whole lot of effort into making their own marine army. Something I think would be interesting to consider, would be to make primaris scale unique to notable units or characters. By taking that route, all of the old outdated charachters now get a nice rescaling and remodeling, all all the people who’ve been collecting space marines up to this point don’t have to replace their entire army to be up-to-date. Plus, making the characters primaris-scale helps to emphasize the step up they are over your typical marine. To be fair, I’d be happy too if Primaris and Normal-Marines could co-exist, with GW keeping the old models in stock while proceeding to make new Primais models as they saw fit. To finish up with the question though, I see the normal space marines as being in a state of stagnation, but certainly not dying.
A Sharp Practice rules set covering right up to the 17th century would be awesome! Just sayin… 🙂 Of course if the focus is purely ion ancients then I guess I’ll just have to quite merrily make do 🙂
You want to look at Sword and Sorcery from Aries Games. It looks like Reichbusters took quite a few ideas from Sword and Sorcery.
Those Rampart sets are crazy. It’s a shame they’re ending this close to the holidays, or I’d be dumping a lot more into it.
Also: Give me a Primaris Ragnar Blackmane, STAT!
This terain looks lovely, and although i realize eventually they will do away with regular space marines im hoping i still got a bit of time, cause i just got some tacticles that i plan to use for KT.
Should orcs (orks) have boots?
I have a box of 100 Space Marines, all nicely painted, hiding somewhere for the last 20 years, I am NOT BUYING ANY MORE !!!
Long time youtube watcher. First time commenting on a video. I really enjoy the weekender updates. The kickstarter bits are very helpful. I’m rampart backer because of it. (Reich busters too).
Hello friends,
a space marine falls, you take the gene seed, enhance it and voila a Primaris Marine 😉 Why replace the casualties with something “lesser”? 🙂
Good show guys
Great episode as always. For an rpg with dogs, check out Pugmire.
Happy weekend
Justin you lost me……. or you lost point of that conversation. I thin you need to relax sometimes and admit to your mistakes.
Great interview with Rich. The 1940 book sounds very good indeed.
Not only has GW stated emphatically that standard SM are not going away, they have versatility that Primarus do not.
Late to the party as per usual. Hope everyone had a cracking weekend. Great weekender as ever. Rampart KS and pieces look bloody fantastic.
I feel like “whether Space Marines are dead” is a question best answered in two parts.
In the Lore:
I don’t think they are going anywhere any time soon. There is plenty of characters that are still space marines and they have set up that it is a life threatening procedure. That and I hope they continue to play on the whole New vs. Old politics (see Chapter Master Seth). Besides, they can live for centuries so those that are around could be with us for many more stories.
On the Tabletop:
This I feel less certain about this side of it. At the end of the day, GW is a business and is out to make money so I can see the argument (whilst recognising it could also been seen as cynical) that they are doing this to make people buy new models.
I personally think, if they want to handle this, we’ll see the specialists being phased out as the Primaris Marks of armour take over: the Devastators replaced by the Aggressors, the Assaults replaced by the Inceptors, the… okay the Reivers are sort of a new thing. The Tactical Squad will stick around as the original Marines are folded into specialist weapons support units deployed along with the Primaris.
Maybe we’ll see rules for folding more weapons choices in a single squad as the Marines band together to march (and gives a rule reason to keep them on the table top).
I dunno, I guess it depends whether they are gonna go full on Primaris replacements and damn the possible (probable?) backlash.
Uuuuuh terrainwinnigs! ME WANT!
If they make those dog kind of things sci-fi they would be great as Space Wolves……. Much better then primaris…….. And you can have a corgimancer…….. ??
Gteat that TFL are coming out with a seris of campaing books. I defintely find the lack of a ‘codex’ can make it harder for me to get into a game.
The campaign I most wanted though was Blitzkreig – lucky me!
I’m glad GW are updating Space Marines with the more true scale Primaris. Now if they could redo the Guard in true scale; I love the faction but hate the models with their goofy sized heads, hands, and feet.
Primaris look nice, I welcome the change, although I’m all for Eldar and Chaos, so it doesn’t affect me :)
rampart
Happy Weekend all! Fantastic episode as ever. Always love seeing Rich on the show, despite not being into historical, he is always a wonderful presence on camera and a true enthusiast for the hobby.
I think from a production standpoint it makes sense for GW to gradually move over to all Primaris, but they can take it at their own pace. I think Warren has a point that the Orks probably need re-working scale-wise on that basis, and possibly the Chaos Marines.
Personally, I love the newer Tau suits and even picked up the Tau starter set for Killteam, though I will say I am not a fan of the stealth suits, they could definitely stand an upgrade.