Cult Of Games XLBS: What Faction To Choose? Trim The Wargaming Fat!
September 11, 2022 by fcostin
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![Warcradle Studios Reveal TINY New 10mm Festive Marker! [Updated]](https://images.beastsofwar.com/2025/11/christmas-kyle-main-600-338.jpg)
It’s the XLBS SHow…………….Happy Sunday Fellow CoGs!
Congrats to the Golden Button Winners! Well DONE.
(I really enjoyed reading through the Building a Lambda-class Imperial Shuttle for Star Wars Legion stuff)
I want one of those for my Legion collection.
Question of this week’s show…….”Can there be too many Factions in a game”?
As far as factions in games goes………..I follow the ‘Rule of Cool’. I buy, pose, and paint what I think is cool and speaks to me. The more faction the better as far as I’m concerned.
Happy Sunday,
May your day be sunny and full of cheer. Also, may your your Telly show the Greatest movie ever made. @free may the wave of your ocean take you to safe shores. #BESTHOUSE
The factions-issue is an interesting one. I can say I’m fine with very few factions, as long as you get enough variety within each faction so that people can field thematically, visually and game-mechanically very different lists within each faction. I like that a lot more than game settings with a lot of factions but where each faction is very restricted regarding themes, visuals and game mechanics.
Thanks for the spotlight! Designing the Jabba’s Palace Battleforce was/is really fun. I’ve recently thrown this first design draft into a larger brainpool on facebook, and it was received very well. What’s more important: It revealed an OP unit as it currently is – The Gamorrean Palace Guard, which I’m currently changing and take the opportunity to make them a bit more interesting. Also, it must be Jawa, not Java – shame on me, who’s making a fuss when people spell Wookiee incorrectly… 😀 If anyone fancies giving it a shot in their own games, I’d be very happy and looking forward to feedback!
Congrats to the other GB-winners!
@free – thx for your happiness – may the force allways be with you
Damn good show. Really, the thought on factions has been an issue and Malifaux sucked me in with the small number and its mix and match with Masters. It was explained to me at first to just go with what I enjoyed the look of. From there the knowledge of game mechanics just kinda slowly grew. I do find issue with the removal of the great mad scientist/union leader Ramos, but Wyrd did take the narrative step in explaining that away as he was jailed. I just happened to catch, when The Other Side dropped, that a certain character resembling Captain Nemo had damn near the same abilities. Eh, I applaud the recycling of mechanics and the loss of a Master. It takes creativity to attend the weft and weave of a story on the loom.
If infantry lists can’t have a chance of beating armoured lists, pick a new set of rules as the others clearly unbalanced and shit…
“For to be free is not merely to cast off one’s chains, but to live in a way that respects and enhances the freedom of others.” (Nelson Mandela). Thank you @fcostin for your encouragement, enthusiasm and constant positivity. You have opened our minds to the importance of gaming, social interaction, diversity and inclusivity. It will be a very difficult challenge to find your replacement for the BoW Weekender and XLBS crew. Good luck with the next chapter in your adventures… and do please finish the Moonstone project! ???????
For me, from a consumer perspective, the more the better. More choices, more variety, more dark corners for me to find a home in. That said, it needs to be easy to find a way in. Infinity is a good example actually. I love the variety and the depth and the lore and the aesthetic but I just keep bouncing off it. And weirdly I don’t like the idea of Code One as much. I want the big game but an easier access point.
Thinking a bit more about what I said, and the contradiction therein. I think strangely, it’s the very existence of N4 that puts me off Code One. You can’t offer me Coors Light when there’s a 10.5% Triple IPA next to it. If CB were a brand new company, and had just released Code One I’d be all over it. Maybe i’m just weird like that!
Hi XLBSers.
So Free is now err….Free
Justin’s space bun will be a Chelsea bun stuck to his beard.?
This discussion about what number factions is interesting. I play Mortem et Gloriam and there are 650 different army lists so the idea that 30 odd lists is too many is rediculous to me. This is not unique in the world of Historical Gaming.
Maybe it is a sci fi or fantasy thing that people can’t cope with more than a couple of factions.
I feel exactly the same. Let your imagination(and wallet! hahahahaa)run wild.
@fcostin good luck for your future, you have been such an asset to OTT. You will be missed.
Is that a model of Gerry when he lost a game he was winning @avernos ?
An army of shite monsters like from Dogma?
Gerrys fleet no strings attached.
Oh @free thank you for providing a pretty face on the show, good luck with the future, and keep having fun with toy soldiers. I haven’t checked out if you have any projects on the go, but keep them up. Was there not a Moonstone table or something?
Space station zero, Alien breed the board game?
An Pascal is helping free move by wrecking the computer room to speed thing’s up ?
Happy Sunday.
Goodbye @fcostin you’ll be missed. Hope to see you around on the site and in the Discord, and maybe the UHH?
That was a nice surprise a golden button, and Ben got Adam Loper to have a look.
Congratulations to the other two winners, both very well deserved.
I don’t play a lot of games now with really any factions. Both Frostgrave and Stargrave don’t have a faction as all the players choose from the one list.
When I did play more 40k and Warhammer Fantasy Battle, the games felt more comfortable and familiar with a smaller faction count. It was also easier to have a good idea what to expect in an opponent’s army.
Sharpe V the French.
A good informative show guy’s.
Run free @free have fun introducing people to the plastic crack.
I think as long as all the factions are reasonably balanced the more the merrier.
One of the bonuses with Kings of War (from Oct 24th) and most other Mantic games are that the faction lists are all in the same book and on Easy Army. No having to shell out for a new book if you want to play a new army or see what a potential opponent’s army does.
Another thing is not complicating things with multiple faction rules. I like a limited set of uncomplicated keywords that are in the main rules that the armies can use rather than only my faction has these rules which are explained over 10 pages.
Gerry are these the squirrels you’re looking for your woodland critter swarms? https://badsquiddogames.com/shop#!/Fairy-Cavalry-Squirrel-Riders-3/p/489052504/category=22056044
A game has too many factions when it’s parent company cannot either a)support them with adequate releases and updates or b)cannot find a design space to create a meaningfully unique game experience for them.
This obviously means there is no arbitrary figure and is of course utterly irrelevant for historical games.
It will surprise no-one to know that I follow Gerry’s philosophy of setting an army in aspic and playing it repeatedly to ‘master’ the nuances rather than endlessly tweaking and changing army lists when I am new to something. I have only played 40k 9th edition to a limited extent but when I do I use my completely unchanged from 7th edition Necron collection and I do fine in games because I know every element of the list like the back of my hand so I feel I make better use of my assets to cover for the weaker points efficiency of some of the older units. Good games always require practice and wargames are HUGELY complex. I would always advise players to change their army lists very little in their first 5-10 games of anything.
Happy Sunday (evening) everyone. With regards to faction lists, I’m with Gerry on this one. I try to build a balanced force that suits my play style and try to learn how to make the best of them. In “Real” war, you seldom get the “best” list, you deal with what you’re given. That said, for complete openness, I don’t play 40K and don’t buy any GW stuff.
Thanks for the fun and laughter Free! Best of luck with your next adventure and future endeavours!
I think any game needs at least 4 factions to survive long term. More than 12 is highly problematic for both the manufacturers and the sellers. Suddenly that’s a lot of shelf/storage space needed to hold stock.
Sub/historic/thematic factions are a great way to flesh out factions without creating totally new lines. For example an Oldhammer Empire army sub-faction may be Middenheim army, limiting the player to White Wolves as the only knights available, replacing Warrior Priests with Ulrican Priests and Great Swords with Teutogen guard. A historical Dwarf army from the War of the Beard may have no black powder weapons. A themed list may be a High Elf army painted to look like it’s from a particular region, with a particular slant towards a troop/play style, but fits within generic High Elf army lists.
When you think about factions they usually fall into predictable stereotypes; fast & light, slow and heavy, glass hammer, super soldiers, undisciplined horde, small and elite, etc. So ultimately the factions of most games fits at least one of those categories to a greater or lesser degree.
I’ve found that asking new players what sort of play style they like from those categories makes it easier to find a faction they may like. For example if I was introducing a historical wargamer to 40K I’d ask what sort of historical armies did you like to play? If they say they loved heavy cavalry charges, then maybe White Scars or Death Wing etc.
New replacement for Free will be Justin in a wig with some make up slapped on. Times are hard so OTT is having to economise…
Happy Monday! Yeah I am late again!
00:00 Free is now a free elf?
01:00 Sucklebus?! oO
02:00 Beer Bong!
03:00 Cat kills CRT?!
03:45 Pascale!!!!!
05:45 dance monkey!
08:30 Horus Heresy?
12:00 CrapKroot?
16:15 You get tabled!
18:15 Swordy swordstones
20:00 Chunky boy!
23:00 There is a Gerry Can: “How to make most of your laser cut markers and stuff”
23:30 Bot War!
24:15 No @brennon Not you too! It’s enough Warzan is blaming me for all stuff he stumbles across XD
25:00 Command Squirrel! Just like in ratatouille.
25:40 CAT!
28:15 That’s the thing with games… you need to remember stuff and shit… nobody has time for that
30:30 “Army in a box” – interesting concept.
32:00 The Ben of many dwarves!
33:00 [Redacted]
36:40 use one games minis in another game… heresy!
38:30 Stoned mooners
43:15 The wrong twitch link? Hmm…..
49:30 Swish!
57:00 Clan Wars!
1:02:00 Blow it all to bits!
1:10:00 “40k for example” … not SAAAAAAAAAAAGAAAAAAAAAAAA?
1:11:11 Sidenote to self: can’t tell if I still am following… beer bad!
1:19:00 Star Wars Legion: until now, 2 core sets, 4 factions. Now: 2 core sets but also 4 Battle Force Starter Set.
1:21:00 tightly scripted 30 minutes… what? no, wrong show
1:22:30 castrate all the games!
1:23:00 great show, bye @fcostin remember your projects!
Beer is gone and so am I.
*plop*
There is balanced need between a good selection and too much choice.
I like Warmachine and Hordes, but over the last few years they added too many factions. Same with GW and the plethora of 40k and AoS armies out there. And the constant stream of faction books by GW as they are updated every few years is bordering on criminal behaviour… extortion for the sake a few stat changes.
With games like Wild West Exodus, Necromunda, Warcry, Kill Team and smaller skirmish games it’s not as bad as they are smaller forces that don’t cost much. Underworlds has only a handful of figures per band so not an issue.
Many factions does give variety, but it feels like the manufacturers are just releasing stuff to make you buy and the fact that so many get errata soon after proves to me that it’s all about the sculpt and not the gameplay.
Happy Tuesday!!!! lol.. I’m a little late to the party but. I think that if a game has some solid two faction starter kits there is nothing wrong with lots of choices for armies. Kings of War is a great example. It was pretty much built as a replacement game for old Warhammer Fantasy players. “you can use whatever you got mini wise. We have many armies for you to use them in”. Or look at games like Fantastic Battles, One Page Rules, To the Strongest. All great games with easy player friendly rules, Rules that lend themselves to players letting their imagination and creative side go crazy. You also have some people who want something more controlled and not overwhelming(friggen Noobs…lol) This old Grognard loves a game with many factions. FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE. You will be missed by all of us. Sad to see you go. May fortune grace your path.
I don’t know how you can talk about numbers of factions in games and not refer to Squats and the ‘squatting’ of factions!
Bye Free, you are going to be missed!
Exulbus, movement of Jah people!
Yeah yeah I’d be late for my own funeral.