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The Weekender XLBS: Warmachine Tactics, DUST & Old School D&D!
July 13, 2014 by warzan
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Hi Guys, video gets to 14:38 and stops – coming up with a network error message. Any thoughts?
happened to me, I just hit F5 and skipped back to that point and it was fine
Seems to be working now.
Another nice relaxing trip down memory lane for me. Thanks for the Books warren, did enjoy seeing things from my teenage years. Myself and a friend laughed so hard when you and Lloyd spoke about the miniatures collection needed for RPG’s, as we first started collecting to play D&D, then moved to Wargamming and now Back to D&D. Our collection has truly gone out of control, but we always intended to have a retirement plan, and ours is now to finish painting the collection. I think I will be busier in retirement and do more “work” than when I am employed.
Happy Sunday!!!!
No better way to start a chilled Sunday morning.
Original D&D figures, I had a few and loved my Elf Ranger. We only play 1st or 2nd Edition rules. In waiting to get 5th edition to see if they took our import during play testing.
Lloyd, I can’t speak for other females but I’m all about the strategy and thrill of out manoeuvering and getting the move that wins it. My emotions are only for a game well played whether I win our loose. I can’t wait for my Dust Kickstarter to arrive.
@warzan have a great holiday.
Justin you need to be very careful mate. If those figures are 1st gen then they contain proper lead and the oxidation could be lead rot. Which is highly toxic.
I’m not saying it definitely is but do some research and double check. And to be honest you should be extra careful with minis this old anyway.
@warzan enjoy Wicklow, they should have better weather for you as they’re closer to the equator then we are =D
Love the D&D figs, I never bothered with them when I started roleplaying, but my cousin did and now I’m wondering what happened to that collection, I may have to give him a bell.
Now that i’ve had a chance to watch all of it I have to say. I used to have those books. What a walk down memory lane. No idea what happened to them but they were great for inspiration.
For the emotional aspect of gaming you have to develop an attachment to the figures. I don’t think you can do that in a standard wargame. You need a campaign where the loss of figures had an impact over time. This is why I love games like the old Necromunda and Bloodbowl. You upgraded the characters as you went along. Which resultes in you taking care of the figures and giving them names. Etc…
haha ….my profile pic already tells you that i loved this episode.
BTW i have the actual citadel minis of those orcs and dwarves paintings. Almost identical poses.
1985????? oh nooo…….it was only last week, surely.
Just turning Saturday here so I suppose it will be ok to watch without my computer self destructing. Thanks gang for another outstanding video. Watched weekender and can’t believe Warren made it through without a mention of Waterloo. Are you slipping brother?
Thanks all for your hard work and dedication to we scraggly bunch, it is appreciated. Have a great vacation, oops, holiday, Warren and family.
Welcome to the great world of “oldhammer” Warren 😉
Have a good holiday Warren. I really want to know what picture made Justin scream like that tho…
The contents of the book are easily available online. We could have a competition to guess which one it was lol.
What a nice week of gaming you 3 had, again a really cool show! To find such treasures – miniatures and books wise – is quite rare.
Speaking of treasures: Cosmic Encounter is one of my all time favorite board games. I believe it was the game Richard Garfield once said in an interview, inspired him to invent Magic 😉 If you happen to get hold of an exemplar, play it.
Best way to start a Saturday and Sunday. Thank you
Fantasy Flight sell a repackaged version of it now.
That should have been a reply to @tuskar about Cosmic Encounter 🙂
Jeah, thanks – after I posted here I searched the web for some information. I will ask a good friend who owns a Comic & Games store (support my local dealer :)), if he can get me one.
It was Bryan Ansell’s policy back in the 80s to brand as many products as possible as rpgs, even when they weren’t. Dark Future is a great example. 1986 was still firmly in the rpg boom though WFB was into its 2nd ed by then and the 3rd ed and Rogue Trader were the following year.
Great show guys. Enjoy you holiday Warren.
WARMACHINE: Tactics – Digital Deluxe Edition… Early adopter (i.e. alpha/beta) £49 on steam !?!?!
As for emotion… “Character” is the word you’re looking for. I know plenty of female players of D&D and MMO who can get into that side. Some of the smaller skirmish games that are more character based might be able to do that for them – especially if there’s a Black Beauty or Rampant Rabbit character 😉
its cheaper now its like £38
No way, I used to have those sheets of dungeon tiles! Purchased at a time where video gaming, roleplaying and wargaming were so niche you could sell all three out of a store the size of my living room 😀
Glory to the eighties!
Happy Sunday,
My hobby week has saw me build and start painting my second Blood Angels Drop Pod (for my Death Company Dreadnaught). And my very first full game of Blood Bowl, i was playing Skaven vs Norse (played by the Manager of the GW store) and I won 2-1 despite some pretty atrocious dice rolling from me.
I’ve also finally built the Rat Ogre for my Skaven team ready for the League Ive joined that starts in 2 weeks time.
That book was a bit of a memory jump start! I got into the hobby a hand full of years after that but used to love digging around for older stuff… and surprise surprise i’m not a fan of the art direction GW went in the following years. I have tonnes of old GW orcs when they had character and didn’t look like something out of a cartoon
Great show as usual guys. I liked the retro items especially.
Oddly enough I’ve just started painting some Otherworld miniatures with a view to play some classic DnD – with the 40th anniversary of Dungeons and Dragons and the launch of 5th edition will you be doing any coverage of Dungeons and Dragons?
Top nostalgia with the D&D minis. That’s how I started buying lead figures, then finding White Dwarf, minis games and the rest is history (which I’ll spare you all).
Love those old miniature books – I was looking through my old WD from the early to late 1990s aaaaaaahhhhh the memories – sigh
And as a Menoth player, Justin’s complaint about being blinded by Kreoss has given me a huge evil grin 😀
Someone should have warned Justin that playing with himself would make him go blind….
Especially at that time of night. Clear evidence of the divine wrath of Menoth.
We who know how to use a disc dial telephone I expect Justin might not even know what that is) seem to have a collective reminiscense her in the comments-section.
Oh yes, I had that book too. I think I actually still might have it around her somewhere.
Justin, many thanks for your opinon on Warmachine tactics, very useful.
Those old D&D minis and books certainly sent me down memory lane. As a youth in the 70s, I used to save my pocket money up to buy the early Citadel miniatures. They always came with that little catalogue with blue coloured cover with the black and white photos inside. Then Warhammer appeared followed by the white dwarf magazine. It was all about the hobby in those days and not a sales brochure like it is now. It had some wonderful crazy tips in it; like how to make a hover tank out of a shower gel bottle. Those were the days
Just yesterday I was DM’ing a session of AD&D 2nd edition with my parents-in-law among the players.
Great video again guys thanks.
Did I see a copy of the new infinity starter box behind Lloyd’s head?
When those three get together, great fun and laughs ensue. Great show guys.
Good show again. Always prefere watching this than going to mass on a Sunday.:)
@dignity The model that you wanted to know what it was is most likely a wererat. Since you never put it under the close cam I’m only 98 % sure.
Bringing emotion into a wargame would probably have to be done in the same manner as in books. It would need to be very personal, perhaps on an almost inquisitor style of play based around your individual character that you put a lot of personal touches in making and then immersing them in a fictional world setting which calls upon their character to get to know the soldiers around them in which the motivation for the strategy and wargame element is to succeed in order to keep these fictional ‘allies’ ‘friends’ and personal ties their character and them as the player has developed towards various people.
Like how when you read a book, watch a show, you have your favorite characters and when they come under threat you can feel the unease and personal attachment of not wanting anything bad to them. And then the relief when you pull off a strategic victory and your friends / allies and comrades in this fictional world/game have survived.
It would probably need to be a ruleset that merges the emotional ride of life, betrayal, friendship, love, humanoid to humanoid interaction with that of this fictional world and array of almost novel-like fictional characters to be forced into a strategic war-game like situation.
That’s pretty much the only way I can see emotion being built into a tabletop game and it would require a lot of narrative.
Aw man, I have to get that book off Amazon! Thanks for showing us that @warzan matey! 🙂
On the topic of women playing wargames – I think that’s the problem I had when I was twelve and tried to get my sister to play 40K with me; it was all combat and tactics, but nothing that really interested her from her perspective. She did enjoy Space Hulk though, and she was good at it too. Maybe because it was a different type of game, and through the missions, there was more of a point to playing, rather than a random battle to kill each others squads.
As @lloyd pointed out, if there was more of an emotional aspect of the games, that would interest them. So perhaps putting that RPG element into the games, that makes you more invested in the characters and what they’re all about, as well as what they’re trying to achieve on the table, would work.
Are the smaller, skirmish games played more by women? Joey Berry on youtube was well into her Malifaux crew, and loved the characters. Then again, she also enjoys Warhammer. I think having something in games that represents women’s ideals would help. Instead of just babes with big guns (lol) that men like, something else should be explored that captures a woman’s imagination that she can identify with. And as Warren said, that’s perhaps covered in more so in RPG’s which is why women play them more. So it’s a bit of a case of getting a combination of giving the game an emotional aspect (something to care about and a reason to play it) and creating forces that women would want to play as (as influenced by RPG’s).
I’d love to see if Jake Thornton gets back to BoW about this – interview him Warren! 😀
Then again, get some women to talk about it. Are there any women games developers out there? Are they more involved in the design of board games and RPG’s? Or even video games? Give me some answers BoW, lol! 😉
Btw – while the forums are being worked on, could the ‘Notify me of follow up comments via e-mail’ check box under the comments, be changed to ‘Notify me of replies to my comments’ instead? Because when I check the box as it it, I get inundated with notification emails of every sod’s comments on the whole damn thread, which I can read myself on the thread itself. That would be a cool change or addition. Cheers. 😀
Great show again guys. @warren enjoy your time off and come back refreshed.
Oh amazing to see all that cool artwork. That old minis book is as old as I am. Anyway, I love seeing all that older artwork. While we have some great artwork today, I love a lot of the old stuff. It doesn’t seem like artists today are interested in doing some of the cooler things they used to do back then. I’m also a huge Frank Frazzeta fan, though, and love to see the more dynamic pictures as opposed to the more static looking pictures we seem to have today.
Just my opinion. Enjoy “Holiday” as you Britts call it. 🙂
wat? what a great books. I own few of Vallejo and his wife books. great stuff.
I feel the urge to go on a scavenge hunt for those books. But I doubt they will be anywhere to find in the Netherlands.
Have you guys considered having community members posting their photos using a off-site service instead of uploading to the site itself?
I used to have those tiles, gw made them for warhammer fantasy roleplay. Cracking show guys!
As far as having an emotional attachment goes — looking at X-Com, the two key things seem to be naming your troops, and attaching a history to them. It’s annoying when your opponent’s Grim Reapers wipe out your unit of Fakyeli — but when they’re Komanda Zhar-ptitsa, who you’ve nursed through three or four firefights and have a little Firebird symbol, or one of them is Utkin, who has never, ever managed to hit or be hit by anything in half a dozen games… then maybe you care more? Even though, points-wise, they’re exactly the same guys?
Obviously, that doesn’t help for a one-off game. But it might suggest a way forward?
What happened to the Wolsung competition guys?
That’s what I was wondering….
Great show as always.
My 3 favorite video games based on Minis games –
Shadow of the horned rat (showing my age)
Space Hulk
Dawn of War (the first one)
I looked at War machine on Steam but seemed a bit pricey.
I have a friend who had Cosmic Encounters and its a great laugh.
Great Episode guys! Would be nice to see more artwork pictures from that book.
Love the classic D&D minis that’s about how many my dad has.
There are emotions in wargames. At least some. You just have to create the scenarios for them. For our clubs DDay this year, be build like 4 tables, played with about 10 guys for an entire weekend.
I was defender at Utah Beach, where endless waves of attackers ran onto my position, while another player attack me from the inland with the 101st Airbourne, while Texas (Naval Gun Fire Support with 16 Guns, At6, FP 1+) was bombing the shit out of my positions.
After about 12 hours of gaming, against two opponents (which delievered a great fight btw) I was extremly exhausted and even a little bit traumatized. I felt like there should be artillery shells falling from the sky. Very emotional 😀
Warhachine Tactics looks very interesting! Didn´t pay for early access so will have to wait until it´s my turn 🙂
That was an impressive amount of ‘ol lead’. Nothing seems to beat old school D&D despite the amazing wealth of resources and RPG’s available today.
Those books were a precious gift – treasure those Warren!
Great show again and wow I won summit as well and also on me birthday to, Thx folks :o)
25:52 Rest in peace headphone users.
@warzan
emotional gameplay mechanics?
Just wait till one of you main characters permanently dies in a narrative campaign
, any good campaign will make it emotional.
Looking forward to you 40K campiege
Keep up all the great work.
Wrote a mechanic for when a member of the tribe witnesses their kin die before them, modified strength positively and accuracy negatively. In one game the tribe was grief stricken so the shaman used his magic (cave painting skill) to draw the tribal icon, this has the affect of modifying accuracy positively cancelling out the negative aspect of the trauma, leaving them with only the positive strength modification. they were able to channel their emotions effectively.