[unofficial weekender] my edition is better than yours

[sundancer 42985xp 0]

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First time visitor to OTT? Then please introduce yourself in the New Member Thread and look around in the Project System. Then come back and read on…

https://www.beastsofwar.com/forums/topic/introduce-yourselves-new-member-thread/

https://www.beastsofwar.com/project/

Read all of this before you start as it will save you any trouble later.

First thing you must do is make your “pledge”. It can be anything gaming related, big or small, and you don’t even have to finish it. No, in here, happiness is the road. Have fun doing whatever it is, but it is not a race. Accompany your work with pictures or we might think you are do something sinister and just using us for cover.

You are also presented with a few questions. It is to get the conversation started. Try and keep your answers ‘conversational’, no text speak, and certainly no “basically”. This is how we all get to know each other better. While you are here feel free to tell us a story, show a picture, joke, tales of love or woe, or just add your own little bit. This is the whole point…in here it is just us.

If you have never taken part before we may bark and bite, but we also like a cuddle! It is all done in the best possible taste and it is character building. feel free to give as good as you get.

A few other things to note: NO RELIGION & NO POLITICS! Glasgow pub rules are in effect. If you need to make a better point then it is fine, but don’t take the piss. And always keep it civil. This includes no philosophy, no home computer culture wars.

Play plenty of music to go with your work. Loud and through proper speakers. Write us a playlist of things we might not have heard before.

Now, after all of that there is only one ‘real’ rule in here and it cannot be broken: NO DICKS! (Exceptions may be made for little fighting men with little plastic/resin/metal wieners)

And don’t forget the highlights of the weekend: The Weekender on Friday and XLBS on Sunday. And the little show that is the unofficial Hobby Hangout over at twitch.tv

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Question of the week:

• Was there (at any point) a game system you liked that actually got better with a new version? Or are you always felling “the old one was better”?

And now back to the show.

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[sundancer 42985xp 0]

Pledge: keep looking for the hobby mojo

Answer: I can’t really recall any “new” edition being better. Most of the time they where “different” and in some cases so much different that they feel like a different game altogether  (X-Wing for example)

No music this week but a new faction for Freebooters Fate:

And now back to look for my mojo

[cruciblecrushParticipant 15xp 1]

I recently went back to AD&D 2nd Ed with the game For Gold and Glory. Got the hard cover of this 257 page rulebook off drivethruRPG. It was a great read and even got me to purchase the old TSR AD&D 2nd Ed GM Guide and Players Handbook to compare the writing. The rules are so much clearer in For Gold and Glory as clarified by Justen Brown. I have not got back to the role play table yet but the rules were a worthwhile read.

[pagan8thParticipant 10865xp 1]

Pledge… ongoing project, but less time so probably not much done.

Second edition rules are often a bug fix for the first edition which is useful… although they often break as much as they fix.

As for old is always better… that’s just nostalgia. I have fond memories of games I played decades ago, but if I played them now I’d probably find the rose tint faded.

The rules are not important, it’s the people you play with… or against. If you enjoy the company, you enjoy the game.

[horati0nosebl0wer 19649xp 0]

Peldge: New year, new army. Now it is time to give love to some Amazons.

I think that D&D got better to the point of 3.0 and the OGL era. Once the genie was out of that bottle the realization that other people had ideas and were writing for what their interests were it was too late to stop the creative flow.

Interesting to see a new force for Freebooter’s Fate. I regret not getting some of Mr. Klocke’s older one off sculpts when I had the chance. His work for Reaper has been a pleasure to collect and paint.

@pagan8th I second the notion of nostalgia and company. The point of gaming is the stories you play within.

 

[sundancer 42985xp 0]

The rules are not important, it’s the people you play with… or against. If you enjoy the company, you enjoy the game.

Very good point!

Sunday is almost over. Next week will be a bit of a hassle. Things need to be prepared!

[limburger 21709xp 0]

As predicted my plans to do anything productive got scuppered, because carnaval happened and that is an event I simply don’t want to miss out on.

First up was the saturday even, where they also introduced the not-bride and not-groom who will have a fake farmers’ wedding on tuesday. This is always done by an entire neighbourhood or a big club and is quite an event.

Fun fact : the neighbourhood is Moluccan in origin.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moluccans

It’s all kinds of awesome when the entire audience sings with the artists on stage.

Today (sunday) was one of the many parades.

New editions better ?

I’d say usually they are *if* they are done for the right reasons and the writers have the balls to do what is needed to fix things.

AD&D 2nd to 3rd edition did fix one of my major issues with the game : the inconsistent dice rolling. The feats system was a good idea, but in hindsight they went a bit over the top with it and it became a mess.

Flames of War 4th edition … definitely another good upgrade. Removing the overly complicated nation specific special rules was a good thing as was the introduction of unit cards with the upgrades factored into the stat lines.

8th edition 40k *was* a good idea … but GW forgot that they either needed to kill factions or change to a D8 or D10 based system (or maybe even multiple dice types) to really allow factions and units to shine without having to add a ton of special rules to them.

Kings of War / Deadzone / Firefight … I’ll just say that Mantic has shown that they know how to fix things and they do it in the most customer friendly manner possible.

 

[sundancer 42985xp 0]

If you change your rules and you need to change your tools (aka dice) is that a new edition or a new game?

It’s Moanday!

[blinky465 17028xp 1]

@limburger – looks like great fun!
@ sundancer – new edition.

Are we talking board games/tabletop games? Or games in general?
I always thought that Laser Squad on the ZX Spectrum was a great game, even if in two-player mode, you had to take turns to leave the room (and call your opponent in once you were “spotted’). But Laser Squad Nemesis was a vast improvement on the mechanic. I still see it as the same game, but maybe more accurately, it’s a game set in the same world?

But for tabletop games, of course it’s got to be Blood Bowl.
All those look-up tables, dice modifiers, add one for this, subtract one for that…. all gone with the block dice – a much easier way to play. Once you got familiar with the rules, you kind of memorised a lot of the look-up tables, but the block dice as a way of getting rid of look-up tables was a nice touch.
There’s no doubt that Blood Bowl 3rd edition  was the same game even with new rules, dice and game mechanics. It was still Blood Bowl!

I just backed by another Kickstarter which is a “new game” that more or less says it’s a tabletop version of an old game. Your favourite 90s RTS no less… https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/kneedeepinhexes/knee-deep-in-hexes/

Here’s your music.
In honour of Gerry’s smart new haircut (which, @avernos, looks fantastic by the way).

[danlee 22443xp 0]

This week’s pledge is to crack on with my Dungeonalia project. Not done much in the past week. While I have this week off I really need to complete the backdrop so when my model arrives later in the month I can complete it on time.

 

• Was there (at any point) a game system you liked that actually got better with a new version? Or are you always felling “the old one was better”? – DnD 3rd edition then 3.5 were improvements in my opinion. The editions of Warhammer that I played (Brettonian vs Skink edition through to the end of the world) generally had improvements each time, though I didn’t like every change each time. Edition changes are by definition a change, which people are generally inclined to be critical of.

[danlee 22443xp 0]

I actually got to this stage about a week ago, but haven’t known how to proceed with making furniture up until now. Time to scratch build with match sticks and lolly pop sticks…

 

Dan’s Dungeonalia 2: Bedroom Fantasy

 

[limburger 21709xp 0]

hmmm … interesting question.

At what point are changes to the rules/mechanics important enough that it (technically) is a new game instead of an updated one ?

You can’t talk about ZZ Top without showing off their videos from the time when MTV still was all about music.

oh … and look at that:

Such a shame music videos became boring crap …

[blinky465 17028xp 0]

@danlee – that looks really nice!
I’m afraid I’m unlikely to get much time to work on my Dungeonalia project before the deadline at the end of this month.
But I’ve thoroughly enjoyed the mix of 3d printing and making “old school” clay tiles with texture rollers. But slap-chopped terrain just looks brilliant! And your columns and  textured walls/floor look really cool.

I’m really quite pleased with how my Head over Heels game has come along so far (a bit further than my latest project write-up) and I really loved working on the puzzles and cards and so on, and it’s really sowed the seeds for a great game idea. I just don’t think I’ll have the time to get it over line to a “finished” state before the end of the month.

And then I saw this in my Facebook feed the other day and it got me questioning my entire approach (using clear acrylic “stands” to make blocks appear to float in different levels).

Magnetic Block Building Block Puzzle Toy MY World Mini Building Set With Various Combination DIY Educational Toys Gifts

and, yes, it’ll mean some limiting factors when setting up rooms – and I’ll have to reprint a lot of the items I already made, to make them more “box-y” and square. But it’s also a fantastic way of building ladders and steps and floating platforms. I think I might just have to give this some serious thought…..

 

[horati0nosebl0wer 19649xp 0]

I had to take the day off and have rested some. Did some adult financial juggling (it has nothing to do with a tub stream @sundancer) and have gotten a better loan rate. This all frees up more mini related money. Hooray! I have finances for my convention attendance.

@limburger Definitely a festive occasion and good to see some fun occurring. As far as the transition from 2 to 3 I think that D&D changed in being less about the grind of tables and more quick calculation. If you had to calculate THAc0 and figured you could never hit what was the point of some encounters?

@blinky465 BB definitely needed some retooling. Chaos and Undead really slammed other teams and there wasn’t much chance for fun. The silliness of it all was great (exploding gobs, halfling consuming trolls, vampires departing to feed) and made for watercooler moments.

Now, what possessed you to cross Minecraft into the hobby?

@danlee old-school material construction, I applaud and approve

 

 

[jeffersonpowers 281xp 0]

Pledge: start on painting newly-acquired stuff and work backward from there.

Music: currently listening to the Raiders of the Lost Ark soundtrack.

Old vs. New: I just got the second edition rule book for Gangs of Rome. I haven’t got it to the table yet, but so far it looks to be an improvement over the first edition, which had some great ideas but was very fiddly, with a lot of unnecessary counters and other junk on the battlefield. It looks like the new version has retained the game’s good ideas while streamlining the game play.

On the other hand, I used to play a lot of casual X-Wing, but the second edition looked like it was only necessary in order to support competitive tournament play (something I have no interest in) so it made for a good excuse to stop buying X-Wing product. I guess it just depends on the game and the player/customer base.

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